Need an Opinion on A Sierra Nevada Clone--Virtual Tasting.

[Mike at Bay]

The pH of your source water is irrelevant. If has little buffering power - meaning small amounts of acid or base will move the pH easily.

Much more important is your mash pH.

Ok I think I get that what I did in the water chem calc was try to lower the alkalinity of the water in an effort to prepare water for the mash. So if I put a tsp of acid in the water before mash in the bag (just guessing based on J A suggestion) that should get me close. Then measure PH post mash and adjust acids if necessary? any guys as to what I did wrong in the software?

 

[J A]

The pH of your source water is irrelevant. If has little buffering power - meaning small amounts of acid or base will move the pH easily.

Much more important is your mash pH.

It's important for sparge water pH...brewing salts additions don't bring the mash liquor into the proper range for sparging. Knowing the pH to start will allow the water calculator to call for correct sparge acid addition.

 

[J A]

OK. Gang...here you go. My first attempt at using the recipe builder/water chem. Something is not right as it is looking for 130ml of phosphoric acid. Otherwise, feels like things are headed in the right direction. Nod to J A and Ozarks Mountain Brewery for the example to work from.

https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/edit/1618918

I think that's just fine. Make a mental note...when you get the actual packets of hops that you'll be using, edit the AA of the hops in the recipe to match. Each crop of hops is different and a couple of points difference in your Magnum addition, for instance, can have a big impact on your final IBU.
Also, pay attention to your pre-boil gravity and volume. If it's different from what's projected in the recipe, either fix it to match or edit the recipe to reflect the difference. Isomerization and uptake is affected by wort gravity as well as time at boiling.
Finally, since you may have a palate that may be more sensitive to certain hop bitterness, maybe start at the low end of the range of IBUs for this beer. You're at 37-ish which is probably pretty pleasant but if you shoot for maybe 32 or 34, you give yourself a little leeway. Anything over 30 will present as slightly bitter. Leave your flameout additions in for a bit while it's cooling (ideally cool down to 180 or so quickly) and you'll get a deeper hop flavor without much added bitterness.
Good luck!

 

[Craigerrr]

This is a good recipe for you to rew,learn, repeat until you get the results you are going for.
As you brew and rebrew, try not to make too many changes each time. That way you can better judge the effect each change has on the beer

 

[Mike at Bay]

It's important for sparge water pH...brewing salts additions don't bring the mash liquor into the proper range for sparging. Knowing the pH to start will allow the water calculator to call for correct sparge acid addition.

Sorry if this is obvious but I BIAB. So, I have my total water to start out (say 7.5 gal), I begin to strike temp of around 160. After an hour pull the bag after the squeeze. The boil usually 60 mins adding hops, whirlfloc at 10 min.

I put Campden in as soon as water is in the kettle. Put salts in pre strike and maybe a bit of lactic acid (a few ml's). Once mash is complete I should measure PH, assuming is it high add a mil, measure again and repeat if necessary.

Does all of that sound right? This recipe/brew will be my first attempt at measuring PH.

 

[Mike at Bay]

I think that's just fine. Make a mental note...when you get the actual packets of hops that you'll be using, edit the AA of the hops in the recipe to match. Each crop of hops is different and a couple of points difference in your Magnum addition, for instance, can have a big impact on your final IBU.
Also, pay attention to your pre-boil gravity and volume. If it's different from what's projected in the recipe, either fix it to match or edit the recipe to reflect the difference. Isomerization and uptake is affected by wort gravity as well as time at boiling.
Finally, since you may have a palate that may be more sensitive to certain hop bitterness, maybe start at the low end of the range of IBUs for this beer. You're at 37-ish which is probably pretty pleasant but if you shoot for maybe 32 or 34, you give yourself a little leeway. Anything over 30 will present as slightly bitter. Leave your flameout additions in for a bit while it's cooling (ideally cool down to 180 or so quickly) and you'll get a deeper hop flavor without much added bitterness.
Good luck!

Thanks.

 

[Mike at Bay]

This is a good recipe for you to rew,learn, repeat until you get the results you are going for.
As you brew and rebrew, try not to make too many changes each time. That way you can better judge the effect each change has on the beer

Thanks. That is the plan.

 

[Craigerrr]

Thanks. That is the plan.

Good for you! It's the best advice I didn't take

 

[J A]

Sorry if this is obvious but I BIAB. So, I have my total water to start out (say 7.5 gal), I begin to strike temp of around 160. After an hour pull the bag after the squeeze. The boil usually 60 mins adding hops, whirlfloc at 10 min.

I put Campden in as soon as water is in the kettle. Put salts in pre strike and maybe a bit of lactic acid (a few ml's). Once mash is complete I should measure PH, assuming is it high add a mil, measure again and repeat if necessary.

Does all of that sound right? This recipe/brew will be my first attempt at measuring PH.

So you're mashing full volume with no sparge...that simplifies things. You probably don't have to do anything but adjust mash pH with acidulated malt or a little acid. The water calculator and the recipe builder will tell you how much.

 

[Dave Y]

Super helpful. Because I am OCD I did buy grains to do this all grain brew again (until I get it right). Props to Ozark as I will base my brew on his recipe. I BiAB. So the math on the hop presence is also very helpful. Don’t sit still long enough to read books these days but clearly I should spend some time researching these basics.

That's great. Don't get obsessed with it though. Make improvements, take notes, if it doesn't work out the way you want it, move to another brew and come back to it another time. Sometimes you'll find when you return to it that an intervening experience helps you nail it.

ETA: when the monthly zoom meeting comes along, give some thought to joining it. Nobody on here has the exclusive ownership of all brewing knowledge. You might pick something up and you can throw out some questions, talk smack or whatever.

 

[Mike at Bay]

So you're mashing full volume with no sparge...that simplifies things. You probably don't have to do anything but adjust mash pH with acidulated malt or a little acid. The water calculator and the recipe builder will tell you how much.

Thanks. I guess that is my basic question right now. When I used the Acid calc in the water chem tool it came back at 130 ml of acid which was clearly wrong. As Donoroto suggested I was trying to fix the source water not the mash. Been playing around with it while it rains here today but I still have a mash ph close to 6. Not sure what data I am using incorrectly

 

[Mike at Bay]

Good for you! It's the best advice I didn't take

 

[Brew Cat]

I collect my total water and treat it all the same for what its worth
we are talking small batch brewing you don't even need to sparge if you don't care to

 

[Craigerrr]

I'm 92 brews in now, I eventually learned the important stuff. Still learning something new on a pretty regular basis participating in this forum!

 

[Brew Cat]

I'm 92 brews in now, I eventually learned the important stuff. Still learning something new on a pretty regular basis participating in this forum!

so you have only brewed for 2 years?

 

[Mike at Bay]

so you have only brewed for 2 years?

Well off and on for many years but mostly extract prior to 2017. Then probably 10 all grain brews. Got started again in 2024 and recently back to BIAB all grain.

 

[Mike at Bay]

so you have only brewed for 2 years?

Oh I get your response now.

 

[J A]

Thanks. I guess that is my basic question right now. When I used the Acid calc in the water chem tool it came back at 130 ml of acid which was clearly wrong. As Donoroto suggested I was trying to fix the source water not the mash. Been playing around with it while it rains here today but I still have a mash ph close to 6. Not sure what data I am using incorrectly

You have to remember to get the volumes right in the water chemistry calc. It calls for the volume of mash water and sparge water separately. In your case there's 7.5 gallons of mash water and zero sparge water. That should give you only mash additions. IIRC, you can choose an acid as an ingredient in the additions section ( I use acidulated malt so I don't need it). That's where you would adjust mash pH if it's needed.


I've found a source for some confusion...you have the recipe method set to extract. You're never going to get any correct information like that.
You also don't have a concentration set for your acid adition...it's not registering if it doesn't have that. If I change to citric and add 1 tsp, it comes up with a reasonable mash pH.

 

[Mike at Bay]

You have to remember to get the volumes right in the water chemistry calc. It calls for the volume of mash water and sparge water separately. In your case there's 7.5 gallons of mash water and zero sparge water. That should give you only mash additions. IIRC, you can choose an acid as an ingredient in the additions section ( I use acidulated malt so I don't need it). That's where you would adjust mash pH if it's needed.


I've found a source for some confusion...you have the recipe method set to extract. You're never going to get any correct information like that.
You also don't have a concentration set for your acid adition...it's not registering if it doesn't have that. If I change to citric and add 1 tsp, it comes up with a reasonable mash pH.

Thank you for looking at it. I am going in there now.

 

[J A]

Thank you for looking at it. I am going in there now.

I can save a revised copy and post it if you want.