Can't taste the hops or malt

[PeterJ93]

Hi everyone,

I'm try to brew a tropical flavoured beer using mosaic, simcoe & citra hops. I've tried quite a few mosaic & simcoe ales, and you always get a very distinct flavour profile yet my beer has none of that. It has a nice tropical aroma, but none of the flavour. It ended up just tasting like a lager, but smelling of an IPA.

Is it to do with how long I boil the hops and the amount? Or did I just need to dry hop it to oblivion and earlier in the fermenter? Any advice would be most appreciated.

Notes on the brew:
- I use a hop spider during the boil to allow for easy removal of the hops.
- I left the brew in the fermenter for 3 weeks.
- I dry hopped this batch twice, once 4 days before and once 2 days before (10g both times)

The hop list for the 19L fermenter batch was:

Amount Variety
Use Time IBU Bill %
8 g Simcoe
Boil 60 min 15.04 19%
8 g Citra
Boil 15 min 6.46 19%
8 g Mosaic
Boil 15 min 7.34 19%
4 g Citra
Boil 5 min 1.3 9.5%
4 g Mosaic
Boil 5 min 1.48 9.5%
10 g Mosaic
Dry Hop 2 days 23.8%

The other issue was malt flavour, The FG dropped to 1.004, much lower than the expected 1.011, I'm assuming this might be why there is no flavour as the yeast ate all the sugars!

Mash record on the day:
- Strike at 67.2C
- Temp dropped to 62.3C after stirring out clumps
- Temp check at -52mins: 67.6C
- Temp check at -40mins: 68.2C
- Temp check at -30mins: 66.4C
- Temp check at -20mins: 65.5C
- Temp check at -10mins: 63.2C

P.S. I'm not sure how to link to the recipe to the post, but it's called "The Brew'd and Groom" from my user recipes.

 

[Yooper]

Oxidation will mute the hops terribly- it could be the issue if the beer is in the fermenter for weeks. Put the late hops in after you turn off the flame and chill to 180F or so (not those 15 minutes/5 minutes during the boil), hold and recirculate for 20 minutes, then chill and then put it in the fermenter . Dryhop in about 3 days, and then again at about day 6 and package as soon as the beer is clearing. Be very very careful to minimize any oxygen exposure at all once fermentation has slowed. That will really help.

 

[Minbari]

If I had to guess, not enough hops. 8g is about .24 oz. Most of the time if I want a hoppy beer i will boil 1-1 1/2 oz for 60, then another 1/2 oz for 30 minutes And then dry hop 2 oz for a few days.

 

[PeterJ93]

Oxidation will mute the hops terribly- it could be the issue if the beer is in the fermenter for weeks. Put the late hops in after you turn off the flame and chill to 180F or so (not those 15 minutes/5 minutes during the boil), hold and recirculate for 20 minutes, then chill and then put it in the fermenter . Dryhop in about 3 days, and then again at about day 6 and package as soon as the beer is clearing. Be very very careful to minimize any oxygen exposure at all once fermentation has slowed. That will really help.

Hi Yooper,

Thank you for your response. I knew that oxidation can cause beer to go off, but I never realised it could be knock out hop flavour! I'll defo follow your guide. I have just a few follow up questions:

1. Would putting the hops straight into the boiler be ok, then maybe just using the hop spider to act as a sieve during the syphoning into the fermenter work well enough?

2. I'm assuming I only need to worry about oxidation after the fermentation process has begun? As I aerate my wort with an aeration stone before I pitch the yeast!

Thank you

 

[PeterJ93]

If I had to guess, not enough hops. 8g is about .24 oz. Most of the time if I want a hoppy beer i will boil 1-1 1/2 oz for 60, then another 1/2 oz for 30 minutes And then dry hop 2 oz for a few days.

I don't know why, but I always associate hoppy beers with high carbonation, maybe I'm just being silly. I'll have a go at cranking up the hops in the recipe and see if that makes a difference.

Thank you Minbari

 

[Daniel Parshley]

I use these same hops. Nosy Bear said, "Less is More", and this is true in the first part of the boil but you need more later to get the hoppy flavors and aroma. I have used 15 gr of Simcoe for the 60 minute boil with good results but up the hops amounts for late additions, hops stand, and fermentation additions. Adding 1 1/2 oz early in the ferment and 3-4 oz for the last dry hop are not uncommon, and some folks use a lot more. My bad results came from adding large amount of high AA early in the boil but later large amounts are far more forgiving and usually turn out well.

 

[Donoroto]

As others said, my first thought was thats not a lot of hops, especially the late hops

Look for the Wayner's Pale Ale recipe. In a 19 liter batch it uses 17 ounces (480 g !) of hops. A bit much, perhaps, but it is hoppy.

 

[GFHomebrew]

Oxidation is my answer.

Explanation
Even using low amounts of hops especially dry hops you should detect them in the final product.
Just my 2c

Don't worry I've been there plenty times before with more hoppy hombrews less so now imananging 02 closed transfers purging recieving keg ect.
i get this more so on commercial beers (most interstate) that have been sitting on a hot shelf.
With descriptors like tropical fruit/apricot aromas and I put it in a glass only to smell sweet malt over hops
That's oxidation lifeless flabby bitter cardboard.

Sorry it's a real shit shoot sometimes buying IPA you just don't know how it's been handled.
Back to topic

 

[Hawkbox]

So... obvious question about covid?

 

[Over The Cliff Brewing]

I agree with oxidation and the amount and when the hops are added to the brew. Depending on what I'm trying to do with an IPA, I might skip boil hops altogether and focus on whirlpool and dry hops. Water chemistry may play a part also.

 

[Minbari]

I agree with oxidation and the amount and when the hops are added to the brew. Depending on what I'm trying to do with an IPA, I might skip boil hops altogether and focus on whirlpool and dry hops. Water chemistry may play a part also.

Agree with water chem. If I want a really bitter IPA, i will up the gypsum.

 

[Nosybear]

Occam's Razor, anyone? Have you had a Covid test?

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

Occam's Razor, anyone? Have you had a Covid test?

Correct when I had it my beer tasted like crap, I thought I had brewed bad beer but after I recovered, the beer was excellent, very strange experience

 

[PeterJ93]

Hi All,

Just wanted to say that I made some adjustments per the above about oxidation and amount of hops and the results have been incredible!

Many thanks to the community for your help in this matter.

 

[GFHomebrew]

Hi All,

Just wanted to say that I made some adjustments per the above about oxidation and amount of hops and the results have been incredible!

Many thanks to the community for your help in this matter.

Awesome to hear man woohoo!

 

[Hawkbox]

Glad it wasn't the vid.