Nottingham Yeast Cells

[mikezepponi@gmail.com]

I know this has probably been beaten to death, but I am brewing my first stout. Just 4 gallons and it will have an OG of 1.043 roughly. I planned on pitching Lallamand's Nottingham with rehydration. I know it says >5B cells per gram, but what is anyone's experience. At 75% that's near 2.5 packet (26 grams). With rehydration I assume it will be a bit higher viability, but how much? I don't want to over pitch, so I thought I'd just go with 2 packs 22G on this first run. Does this sound reasonable?

 

[Minbari]

No, it doesn't.

1 pack is more than enough. That's only 4 gal of 1.043 beer. I just did a stout, 5 gal, 1.055 and 1 pack finished in 2 days.
Have never rehydrated dry yeast either. Just pour it in, it will get wet

 

[mikezepponi@gmail.com]

No, it doesn't.

1 pack is more than enough. That's only 4 gal of 1.043 beer. I just did a stout, 5 gal, 1.055 and 1 pack finished in 2 days.
Have never rehydrated dry yeast either. Just pour it in, it will get wet

Thank you so much. It just seemed like a lot!

 

[dmtaylor]

One pack is an overpitch. I would use 1/2.

 

[mikezepponi@gmail.com]

Oh thank God. That makes me feel a lot better. My original recipe was using a different yeast and I had calculated 8 grams. I think the Lallamand's website freaked me out. You know that feeling when your subconscious is telling you--"that can't be right?" It was the "greater than" symbol before the 5B that made me think they were just covering their backsides. I appreciate you input. Experience always trumps estimates.

 

[Donoroto]

And, don't fear the mild overpitch.

 

[Sandy Feet]

I pitch two knowing I am overpitching, and for 5 gallons at gravity that is a little higher. One should be fine, but don't fear overpitching.
Not familiar with Lallamand, but one of my favorite, normal alcohol Porters was with the White Labs Guinness strain. WLP004 I think?
If you are using something close to that strain, it should be tasty.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

Just pitch the one pack. Trying to save a 1/2 pack for later and keep from getting contaminated is a PITA, plus you should try to avoid exposure to oxygen. Not worth it. As far as rehydration is concerned, it does help with shortening lag time in my experience, but you can skip it.

It's not an over pitch at one pack, but it is a slight under pitch at a 1/2 pack.

 

[Megary]

Just for discussion purposes...

Does an overpitch reduce yeast characteristics? Maybe this is more of an ale brewing question, but I've read that some of the more expressive yeasts won't give you that fruitiness and those wonderful esters if overpitched. Probably wouldn't matter to overpitch with BRY-97 or WLP001, but an English Ale yeast or a Hefe yeast??? Something to consider.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

Just for discussion purposes...

Does an overpitch reduce yeast characteristics? Maybe this is more of an ale brewing question, but I've read that some of the more expressive yeasts won't give you that fruitiness and those wonderful esters if overpitched. Probably wouldn't matter to overpitch with BRY-97 or WLP001, but an English Ale yeast or a Hefe yeast??? Something to consider.

You have over pitch a considerable amount to get the yeast outside of it's normal profile, a slight under pitch with English strains can improve the ester profile, but so can shallow fermenters.

The fermenter's geometry can effect the yeast profile by either increasing or decreasing the dissolved co2 in the beer. The co2 causes the yeast to reduce esters, so the ratio between depth and surface area can change the beer. A 1:1 ratio is better for ales and a 3:1 ratio is better for a clean lager since the latter will contain more dissolved co2.

 

[Josh Hughes]

No, it doesn't.

1 pack is more than enough. That's only 4 gal of 1.043 beer. I just did a stout, 5 gal, 1.055 and 1 pack finished in 2 days.
Have never rehydrated dry yeast either. Just pour it in, it will get wet

He speaks the truth

 

[NorthCoastBrewer]

Lallemand has a pitching rate calculator (link). It's worth a look as some strains (like New England) suggest a much higher pitch rate than the commonly mentioned (and generally correct) "1 sachet per 5 gallons for a normal strength beer".

For 4 gal of OG 44 at 70F, it suggests 8.5 grams.

I like @HighVoltageMan! 's idea for pitching the full sachet to avoid figuring out what to do with a small amount in an open package.

 

[dmtaylor]

Just for discussion purposes...

Does an overpitch reduce yeast characteristics? Maybe this is more of an ale brewing question, but I've read that some of the more expressive yeasts won't give you that fruitiness and those wonderful esters if overpitched. Probably wouldn't matter to overpitch with BRY-97 or WLP001, but an English Ale yeast or a Hefe yeast??? Something to consider.

YES

 

[Megary]

Lallemand has a pitching rate calculator (link). It's worth a look as some strains (like New England) suggest a much higher pitch rate than the commonly mentioned (and generally correct) "1 sachet per 5 gallons for a normal strength beer".

For 4 gal of OG 44 at 70F, it suggests 8.5 grams.

I like @HighVoltageMan! 's idea for pitching the full sachet to avoid figuring out what to do with a small amount in an open package.

If pitching a bit less makes a better beer (and I’m not saying it does, but it might) then just throw the rest of the yeast out. In other words, I’d rather a better tasting beer and waste a little yeast than using the full pack and being a bit underwhelmed. Again, this is all an open discussion, and certainly dependent on yeast strain.

 

[dmtaylor]

If pitching a bit less makes a better beer (and I’m not saying it does, but it might) then just throw the rest of the yeast out. In other words, I’d rather a better tasting beer and waste a little yeast than using the full pack and being a bit underwhelmed. Again, this is all an open discussion, and certainly dependent on yeast strain.

NO

 

[mikezepponi@gmail.com]

I pitch two knowing I am overpitching, and for 5 gallons at gravity that is a little higher. One should be fine, but don't fear overpitching.
Not familiar with Lallamand, but one of my favorite, normal alcohol Porters was with the White Labs Guinness strain. WLP004 I think?
If you are using something close to that strain, it should be tasty.

Thanks. I hope it's tasty. I love dark brews. I am hoping to get a stir plate for Christmas, and then I'm looking forward to getting some more exotic yeast cultures. This is a pretty simple recipe that I'm going to use as a baseline for dark beer. I'll probably just pitch 1 packet and see how it goes. If it's too clean --I'll just have to make a bigger batch next time. Notice I didn't say pitch less.

 

[mikezepponi@gmail.com]

Lallemand has a pitching rate calculator (link). It's worth a look as some strains (like New England) suggest a much higher pitch rate than the commonly mentioned (and generally correct) "1 sachet per 5 gallons for a normal strength beer".

For 4 gal of OG 44 at 70F, it suggests 8.5 grams.

I like @HighVoltageMan! 's idea for pitching the full sachet to avoid figuring out what to do with a small amount in an open package.

Well bada bing! This is exactly what I was looking for, and right where I came in originally. 8G !! Thank you.

 

[mikezepponi@gmail.com]

Just pitch the one pack. Trying to save a 1/2 pack for later and keep from getting contaminated is a PITA, plus you should try to avoid exposure to oxygen. Not worth it. As far as rehydration is concerned, it does help with shortening lag time in my experience, but you can skip it.

It's not an over pitch at one pack, but it is a slight under pitch at a 1/2 pack.

Thanks. Great advise, and I agree it would be a PITA to fiddle with a partial package.

 

[GFHomebrew]

If pitching a bit less makes a better beer (and I’m not saying it does, but it might) then just throw the rest of the yeast out. In other words, I’d rather a better tasting beer and waste a little yeast than using the full pack and being a bit underwhelmed. Again, this is all an open discussion, and certainly dependent on yeast strain.

Or pitch that into some DME and just leave it in a jar to save for next batch.
That's the Cheap Arse comming out in me !

 

[Sandy Feet]

Thanks. I hope it's tasty. I love dark brews. I am hoping to get a stir plate for Christmas, and then I'm looking forward to getting some more exotic yeast cultures. This is a pretty simple recipe that I'm going to use as a baseline for dark beer. I'll probably just pitch 1 packet and see how it goes. If it's too clean --I'll just have to make a bigger batch next time. Notice I didn't say pitch less.

A baseline Porter/Stout that comes out consistently is a wonderful thing. When I first went BIAB, some nice people at the HB store suggested one extra thing that put it right where I wanted it. The first was an American Porter. I have since done an English Oatmeal Porter, a Sweet Potato Porter, and a Pre Pro Porter/Dark Mexican Lager with it. I have been happy with all of them. Good luck to you.