White IPA and Mashing with Wheat Malt

[Eyeball]

Hello all,

We have a gas-fired brewing system with a water cooler mash tun, and we would like to do a white IPA, and have read that we need to do a step-mash or a decoction mash, but I would like to hear from others who have tried either of these in the past before we commit to trying one of them. Or, if its not necessary at all.We tried mashing as normal the last white IPA we tried and we had terrible efficiency.

Thanks in advance for any comments from your experience
Kevin

 

[vthokiedsp]

what % of your grain bill is the wheat malt? personally, i throw rice hulls into the mash if i'm using wheat malt. if it's a real small amount of wheat, i just cut back on the amount of rice hulls. for the cost and ease of using hulls, it's worth it to avoid efficiency and sparge issues.

i haven't done it [decoction] yet. for my next batch of hefe, i plan to do it for comparison sake (didn't decoct last time). from what i've read, it accomplishes 2 things...can help w/ conversion for under modified malts (shouldn't be a problem for your IPA) which in turn can help produce a drier/maltier beer, and it allows you to step through the different rest phases (debatable if needed at all with today's well modified malts). for a hefe, the first rest (ferulic) can help with accentuating the clove phenol from the yeast. it could help with your efficiency issue but there are probably easier ways to try to get a higher efficiency (e.g. mash on the lower end, change your water/grain ratio for your mash).

or buy an extra pound of grain or so to get you to the OG you want.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

you should not use 100% wheat, it needs barley to help convert to a higher sugar level, I would go 50% of each and you could step mash or just mash longer, the wheat can be a harder kernel and needs to soak longer to be as soluble as barley, what I said is also misleading because the grain has no husk but they dry it more making it harder but also here is a long article with all sorts of information maybe even contradicting what I just said, I'm just giving an answer from my personal experience


https://www.morebeer.com/articles/WHEAT_MYTHS

 

[Hawkbox]

I've made this a number of times, the only real step to make it a WIPA would be to up the hops. The first time I did it I used rice hulls, but I currently use a brewbag in my mash tun.
https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/552447/broken-glass-belgian

I'm a big fan of the brewbag https://www.brewinabag.com/ I just throw it in the washer on the rinse cycle after my brew day and it's ready to go for the next batch.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

yes the challenge would be using the cooler as a mash tun, so longer mashing would not work without constantly adding hot water, I mash for as long as 2 hours with certain beers and continuously recirculate so its easy for me, 90 minutes is the norm though and what your describing should be fine 1 1/2 hours total

 

[J A]

you should not use 100% wheat, it needs barley to help convert to a higher sugar level, I would go 50% of each and you could step mash or just mash longer,

From a Beersmith blog on diastatic power in malt:
Wheat provides diastatic power nearly equal to barley so it can be used in large proportions to make wheat beer.
There are several other references that indicate similar.
Briess specs show Wheat at 160 Lintner and Pilsnen at 140 Lintner. I don't think it would be a problem to use almost all wheat malt. Efficiency might suffer without a decoction, I suppose. Flaked wheat, of course would be different and would benefit from rice hulls if used in percentages that were high for adjunct grist.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

the worst beers I've ever made were 100% wheat, not only did they taste bland they were half the alcohol, first time I just thought I made a mistake but confirmed it with the next brew, even mixing them with another beer mad that taste bad

 

[Nosybear]

From a Beersmith blog on diastatic power in malt:
Wheat provides diastatic power nearly equal to barley so it can be used in large proportions to make wheat beer.
There are several other references that indicate similar.
Briess specs show Wheat at 160 Lintner and Pilsnen at 140 Lintner. I don't think it would be a problem to use almost all wheat malt. Efficiency might suffer without a decoction, I suppose. Flaked wheat, of course would be different and would benefit from rice hulls if used in percentages that were high for adjunct grist.

Agreed. You can do a 100% wheat grist and it will convert just fine. What it won't do well is lauter. In fact, it will set up like day-old oatmeal. Rice hulls are your friend for this. BTW, I've done a 100% wheat grist before (Graetzer/Grodziskie). It does work fine but the end flavor is very subtle.

 

[J A]

Agreed. You can do a 100% wheat grist and it will convert just fine. What it won't do well is lauter. In fact, it will set up like day-old oatmeal.

Really?! I've only used wheat malt in smaller percentages or 50/50 so I'm not that familiar with all- or mostly-wheat. Intuitively, it seems like the starches present in the grain's interior layers would convert with enzymatic action like barley, but I suppose there's extra proteins that clog things up. Duly noted!

 

[Nosybear]

Really?! I've only used wheat malt in smaller percentages or 50/50 so I'm not that familiar with all- or mostly-wheat. Intuitively, it seems like the starches present in the grain's interior layers would convert with enzymatic action like barley, but I suppose there's extra proteins that clog things up. Duly noted!

It's not the proteins, but the gums and the lack of hulls that clog things up. Rice hulls, and I mean a LOT of rice hulls, can loosen the mash up to where it will lauter. Which reminds me, I haven't done a Graetzer in quite some time....

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

I buy rice hulls 10 pounds at a time, I use them in every brew to prevent stuck recirculation

 

[Eyeball]

I buy rice hulls 10 pounds at a time, I use them in every brew to prevent stuck recirculation

We bought some rice hulls when we started all-grain brewing and haven't used any yet, nor have we had any issues with a stuck mash (yet). I feel like having rice hulls on-hand has been cheap insurance.

 

[Hawkbox]

I used them once with a friend in my first all grain brew. But since going to a brewbag I've never felt a need for them.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

I have a 3 pot continuous recirculating herms system, its a must on my set up

 

[Hawkbox]

I no sparge most of the time with a cooler and one pot. My rig isn't fancy enough to compete with you.

 

[GFHomebrew]

I noticed on a recent brew where I used wheat and Rye that even though I biab the sparge sucked it took forever for the wort to drain down through the bag so maybe rice hulls are applicable to BIAB brewing.

 

[thunderwagn]

I noticed on a recent brew where I used wheat and Rye that even though I biab the sparge sucked it took forever for the wort to drain down through the bag so maybe rice hulls are applicable to BIAB brewing.

They can help for sure. Everyone says you can't get a stuck sparge with biab, but I've been damn close several times. Close enough that I would call it stuck and a pain in the ass. I've added rice hulls before to biab. It can help with heavy wheat or rye grain bills. Did for me at least.

 

[Mase]

Is there any harm with adding rice hulls to every mash?

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

I do it its fine, for a 12 gallon brew I add 2 to 3, 2 - handed wads full

 

[Mase]

I do it its fine, for a 12 gallon brew I add 2 to 3, 2 - handed wads full

Yeah.... I get a few close stuck sparges with my round cooler mashtun from time to time and as long as there’s no flavor, colors, sugars or otherwise that can get extracted, what’s the harm. I may just add that routine to every brew. The banana Nut Bread Ale definitely benefited with a half pound of rice hulls as there was no sign of stuck sparge at all.