What's Up with the Boil Size in Recipe Builder

Discussion in 'Recipe Editor' started by Nosybear, Aug 6, 2019.

  1. DaveCS

    DaveCS New Member

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    This has been causing me pain - (refer to my question regarding incorrect gravities) - I have been comparing the recipes I’ve created lately with another application and, based on my brew days, it seems Brewer’s Friend’s changes of late have done nothing to improve my brewing experience - numbers seem to be askew (even if slightly) - and I would concur with Nosybear’s post here - I’m unclear what this “new feature” is adding.

    Before this “feature” was added my brews and brew days were always bang on - now, I’m not so sure about creating recipes here and have been considering leaving for another application and not renewing.
     
  2. DaveCS

    DaveCS New Member

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    Bingo - that’s my issue as well - scaling up old recipes now completely toasts that recipe - I do understand what Yooper is saying in the post directly above my first reply in this thread and I really hope that these “errors” (note the quotes) can be corrected.

    The biggest problem for me is not “trusting” the software/site anymore - it’s not so much that improvements aren’t welcome or needed but ones that seem to make an end user “lose trust” in the system are not necessarily good.
     
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  3. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

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    I just assume that every brew day will be starting over pretty much at square one until I can assimilate relevant changes and/or the bugs get worked out of whatever interface it has with other aspects of the Brew log functionality.
     
  4. Yooper

    Yooper Administrator
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    Yesterday, we made it so that all old recipes would NOT be affected to avoid changing tried and true recipes. The changes should happen only in new recipes, where the calculation will be accurate.
     
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  5. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

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    ^^^^That will be awesome! It'll allow for making comparisons to old data and data derived with the "new" calculator and make changes to reflect more accurate calculations. And in the meantime it'll be easier to work with established recipes. Thanks!
     
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  6. Drewfus1

    Drewfus1 Member

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    These changes definitely tossed a wrench into my brew day on Saturday. I made a minor mash temperature tweak to a robust porter recipe as I was mashing and saved it without noticing that BF had wildly skewed my numbers when I opened it for editing... I didn't notice until I looked at the recipe again as I was heating to boil. Then I was gnashing my teeth trying to recalibrate while many other tasks called for my attention. Initially I thought it was a glitch with the program, but since I was in the middle of a batch, didn't have much time to look into things. I nailed my OG (1.064) on the porter based on the originally calculated number (the updated builder claimed it would be 1.052) but I have no idea where the bitterness will land (probably somewhere between 15 and 25) because I'd made changes to hop additions the day of before figuring out exactly what was going on with BF.

    My process very much revolved around the numbers BF had given me in the past. If this new configuration is more accurate, then some of my setup numbers/volumes/efficiency were certainly off. When I initially input many of the values for my profile and setup, I'd barely used my recirculation system and newer kettles. This morning I re-calibrated a few recipes based on data points that I do have from recent batches (OGs, observed boil off rate, kettle losses, etc) and realize that for all my numbers to jive I must be getting 85% efficiency rather than the 70% that I had calculated many many batches ago. That's the only way I get numbers to line up.

    Initially I was angry that a change had been made and it had messed with a brew day. I also wasn't happy about having to rework a bunch of recipes. But in retrospect, numbers that I had initially programmed in to BF were inaccurate and my system has changed considerably since I set everything up. It was past time for me to calibrate everything again. I guess I just got complacent because I was hitting my gravity targets and the beer was tasting great. An "if it ain't broke, don't fix it" complacency. I'm going to be very observant on my next couple brew days and take very detailed notes on everything so I can triple check that all the profile/general/equipment/efficiency numbers I now have plugged in are accurate.

    My only request is: the next time you make an update that can/will have a wide-ranging effect on numbers and calibration, please let us know in advance. Thank you!
     
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  7. Yooper

    Yooper Administrator
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    I apologize for that- the intention was NOT to change all recipes and skew the data we already had in the system that worked. Unfortunately, that happened it it took two days to change it back properly. That was definitely not expected.
     
  8. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

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    i noticed the post boil calc button is still calculating too far based on my equipment profile, and then realized that the Recipe Builder was choosing an alternate equipment profile and wasn't auto selecting my default profile... for those having problems, check to see that the recipe builder is choosing your correct profile? everything seems to be working on my end now that i fixed that quick issue.
     
  9. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

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    Yeah...I noticed that as well. The calculator seems to be choosing the most recently added equipment profile rather than the one set as default. Beware.
     
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  10. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    How do we change it?
     
  11. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

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    make sure your equipment profile is square in your profile settings, then in the editor, choose the big brown MORE button next to color and style, and Equipment profile is available from a drop down list.
     
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  12. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    Dang it, I knew that! Sux getting old...
     
  13. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

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    #53 Trialben, Aug 20, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 20, 2019
    This is probably to do with incorrect boil size. The grain absorbtion losses aren't being calculated in the "quick water requirments" this is giving me the wrong water requirements. I'm trying to brew a double batch for first time this weekend but I can't trust the calculated losses in the quick water requirements.
    Screenshot_20190820-204921_Samsung Internet.jpg
    See that grain absorbtion is my profile setting not my overall grain/water losses this is for 7kg batch so should be 5.6lt.
     
  14. snails07

    snails07 New Member

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    I was initially pretty pissed at the change, but Yooper's explanation makes sense. And combined with Drewfus1's comments, I think it will be good moving forward.

    All my previous recipes and equipment profiles are now cactus but it gives me a good chance to calibrate everything again.

    The functionality of the 'Calc' button needs to be looked at though. If I adjust boil time by say half an hour but forget to hit calc, everything will be off. It should be auto calculated.

    Also, if I have set my equipment profile and then select say 30 litre mash with 4kg pilsner malt (BIAB), it would be awesome for everything to just calculate based off of that.
    It would calculate grain absorption, pre-boil vol and everything else from there. Or am I missing something? It seems we set all these parameters but then still have to manually enter volumes etc.
     
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  15. DaveCS

    DaveCS New Member

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    I did note the “Equipment Profile” issue as well but have adjusted and tried to make “checking it” one of my standard steps when I create a recipe.

    I will review the changes and create a new recipe (based on an old, verifiable, one and see how the changes - or rolled back changes fare)

    Thanks to the admins and staff for paying attention to this.
     
  16. AHarper

    AHarper Active Member

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    #56 AHarper, Aug 25, 2019
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2019
    WRT Number 1 above...
    I asked for that months ago...

    ALSO. Although the new calculations correct for Boil off etc and therefore OG values... I think there is an unexpected affect on IBU calculations... Please see my post of yesterday... or whenever under IBU calculations
     
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