M47 -Belgian Ale

Zambi

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I've made a batch of this before and it came out nice (my standards & taste buds are not very sophisticated ;) )
I got 0.5 bag left, so I want to make another batch.
I should have temperature control this time. So 2 questions: what do you think of the recipe and what temperature to use? I thought of 20-22 oC?
Screenshot_20221115-171600.png
 
I like your recipe, and your intent to ferment right in the middle of the yeast’s range. If you offered me a bottle, I would drink it, as long as I got to enjoy the view from your yard.
 
Been playing a bit with the inkbird.
If I use a set point of 20 oC and a cooling differential of 2 oC, I'll be sitting at a temperature range between roughly 19 to 22 oC.
The compressor stops at 20 oC, but the fridge cools for a little longer.
It's not hunting, so I think a decent setting (bearing in mind that the amount of liquid in the fermenter acts as a buffer and I'm measuring air).
What do you all think?

Or should I ask in a different thread?
 
Been playing a bit with the inkbird.
If I use a set point of 20 oC and a cooling differential of 2 oC, I'll be sitting at a temperature range between roughly 19 to 22 oC.
The compressor stops at 20 oC, but the fridge cools for a little longer.
It's not hunting, so I think a decent setting (bearing in mind that the amount of liquid in the fermenter acts as a buffer and I'm measuring air).
What do you all think?

Or should I ask in a different thread?
Sounds just fine. I use a differential of one degree, but my mains power is more plentiful.
 
Sounds just fine. I use a differential of one degree, but my mains power is more plentiful.
I was thinking of reducing to 1 or 1.5 oC, but it's still hot outside (actually again), so a bit scared that it heats up so fast, it will go on/off too quickly.
Although there is a compresser delay.

Maybe I just keep it like I got it now and assess. It will easily be more controlled than my cooler box :)
 
My brain doesn't want to convert C to F right now, but I ferment in a garage in Florida. It gets hot. 3 degrees F works. If I want to brew around 67.5 F, I set it at 66. It will rise to 69, and the unit will come on. The compressor is set at 5 minutes just in case.
 
Thanks Sandy,
If I'm not mistaken..
Your setting of 3 F equates with 3 x 5/9 C, (so 1.67)
So I'll start off with 2, to check, then maybe reduce a bit. And up compressor delay to 5 min
 
The reason why I use 5 minutes is that I screwed up my old AC system once or twice by not having patience. 5 minutes was suggested by the AC company. If that amount of time is good for an AC, it is good for a refrigerator.
I initially wanted to use a 5-degree temperature variation for my thermostat too, but a local brewer (one that made money from brewing) told me to make it 3, and it has worked up to this point.
 
The recipe looks yummy, but I like Belgian beers, so I might be a bit biased.

Like Don, I use a 1.0F (0.8C) differential. 1.0C differential would be 1.8F.

What Inkbird do you have? The differential on my ITC-1000F is basically a deadband or hysteresis setting around setpoint. 1 degree is the lowest setting in Fahrenheit mode, so I'm considering swapping it over to C, where the deadband/differential can be set all the way down to 0.1C for closer temperature control. I can speak both metric and Imperial units and often do the conversions in my head. The missus is an Aussie and I'm a retired engineer, so I have to.

I have the same dilemma, but for a different reason. I'm controlling batch temperature, not chamber temperature. That's going to be the next change to my fermentation process so I can stabilize the temperature control. The idea is to control the min/max temperature of the chamber near the same setpoint as the fermenter to minimize the swings. I'll use the chamber temperature as a permissive to heat or cool, not to actually control it. This will let me limit the difference in the batch and chamber temperatures and control the swing better by keeping them closer. It will also change the rate at which the batch temperature changes if the chamber temperature is closer. Got my concept on paper, and some tinker toys to use for the idea. Now it's a matter of building it and trying it out.

The whole objective is controlling the yeast propagation rate and fermentation rate for the sole purpose of targeting the qualities of the yeast. Can't do that if the temperature is swinging willy-nilly and bumping up against the end stops or even going outside the optimal range. What you've done is certainly an improvement. But if you'll trend what's happening to the batch temp (now that you have a display to check it), you'll see how loose the system really is. Holding a steady temperature outside the fermenter will help, but inside and outside will help more. Once I have better control of the batch temperature, then I can do things to better understand different yeasts and actually start targeting favorable characteristics of the yeasts. Maybe I'm being a little too anal about the temperatures, but like I said, it's the engineer in me that likes nice precise controls. Ask @Donoroto , engineers simply can't help themselves. If it ain't broke, we'll fix it. If it is broke, we'll reinvent it. If it doesn't fit, we use a bigger hammer. I don't think it's so much arrogance as it is proving to ourselves that we were right.

I've got a little 40 year old GE Series One PLC with 24 inputs and 24 outputs available that I'm going to use for some experimentation once I get a second controller put in place. It's a demonstrator that I used many years ago when I was selling and doing automation projects on small scale stuff, and it still works beautifully. Now that I'm adding gizmos to help with the processes, might as well make the repetitive stuff automated. It'll be a fun project that'll keep me out of the missus' hairdo, thus keeping me out of the doghouse. My next order to Amazon might put me there anyway. Hotplates, 3 Inkbird controllers(another ITC1000F and two PID's), a dozen SSR's (the IO on the PLC is 24V), an enclosure, some MIL spec connectors, cable ......

I brew to learn so that I can learn to brew better. I feel like if I understand all there is to know about the individual processes, I can make some top-quality stuff.
 
Made Me laugh, too true
 
I use the inkbird itc-308...
I'll find out where the sweet point is.
For now, I followed Sandy's advice on a 5 minute compressor delay.
I'm observing and learning :)
 
I use the inkbird itc-308...
I'll find out where the sweet point is.
For now, I followed Sandy's advice on a 5 minute compressor delay.
I'm observing and learning :)
I like the 308 from the description. The 1000F is just a more industrial panel mounted version that you have to wire your own outlets or connections to your devices for. $17 for it, versus something like $30 for the 308, IIRC. Looks like exactly the same firmware, though. I like the 308 with bluetooth interface as well, but I can have 3 of the 1000F's for the same price. I'm ok with building my own panels and wiring things. I'm an electrical engineer, I better be.

That 5 minute compressor delay is a little long, but as I pointed out, probably not long enough to hurt anything in the grand scheme of things. Temperature simply doesn't swing fast in any significant liquid volume. I'm sure you've waited a time or two for a water bottle to cool down.

Check the operator's manual for the cooler/freezer. There's usually a blurb in it somewhere about what to do if it trips on overload or overtemp, and how long to wait for the overloads to cool back down. There's also the time it take for the refrigerant to equalize pressure so that you're not trying to start the compressor in a 'dead head' situation, meaning high pressure still present. That's usually a pretty short time, though.

Once I get my control up and working, I'll post a drawing of what I did.
 
Roadie, you forget I'm in Africa ;)
We make things work, somehow.
We get powercuts, spikes and all (not me anymore) and mostly things keep going.
And what's a manual ;)

Anyway, she's behaving very well and keeping the temps pretty OK without working too hard
 
Roadie, you forget I'm in Africa ;)
We make things work, somehow.
We get powercuts, spikes and all (not me anymore) and mostly things keep going.
And what's a manual ;)

Anyway, she's behaving very well and keeping the temps pretty OK without working too hard
Good to hear. Are you just controlling air temperature, or are you monitoring the batch temperature?
 
Probe is tight against fermenter outside
I realise it would be better to have a probe inside the liquid, but I can't.
I realise it will be cooler there than in the centre of the liquid. Hence my setting is on the lower side of yeast temperature range.
As said, it will be better than I had, plus I believe yeasts can handle quite a bit, judged by brewing quite acceptable beers without any control.
For sure, it can be better, more controlled, but can I taste it?

Since you are an engineer...
No, I won't be able to exactly replicate what I made :eek:
 
Probe is tight against fermenter outside
I realise it would be better to have a probe inside the liquid, but I can't.
I realise it will be cooler there than in the centre of the liquid. Hence my setting is on the lower side of yeast temperature range.
As said, it will be better than I had, plus I believe yeasts can handle quite a bit, judged by brewing quite acceptable beers without any control.
For sure, it can be better, more controlled, but can I taste it?

Since you are an engineer...
No, I won't be able to exactly replicate what I made :eek:
It will certainly be an improvement. I noticed one pretty easily. I had a complete change in the flavor of one of my favorite brews, for the better! What I'm going to do is add a second one to watch the chamber temperature. If I use a 1 degree differential on the one in the batch, I'll put something like a 2 degree differential on the chamber air. That will shut off heating or cooling when I'm more than 2 degrees off setpoint on the outside, but try to keep it turned on if I'm not within 1 degree on the inside. The lower differential in temperature will make the temperature change in the batch a good bit slower, meaning it will stabilize a lot better.

I think you might actually taste the difference, especially if you're using a specialty yeast that targets a particular flavor. The best part is you can set the temperature for your cold crash and walk away from it. You don't have to keep coming back to see if you're freezing your beer. It was certainly an improvement in my book, but I'm a complete idiot when it comes to beer judging. I just know it changed the outcome of my fermentation enough for me to detect it, and I'm not lugging ice out there to struggle with the heat.
 

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