IPA-ish project: what do we think?

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

for beginners high risk of contamination for lack of knowledge on cleanliness I would guess

 

[Nosybear]

Some manufacturers package their dried yeast with nutrients as well. This may be a factor, although I would guess the risk of contamination might be a factor as well. I don't do kits, haven't since my second brew, so I don't know what yeast is packaged with them (one exception: I did a test brew for a local homebrew shop) but the dry yeasts I use all recommend rehydration in plain water at 86° to 95°. We don't rehydrate yeast for wine even though the pressure on the cells is higher due to higher sugar content of the must. Bottom line, your choice. If you're not getting off flavors due to underpitch, sprinkle on top of the wort and save yourself the time. For beer, I prefer to have my yeasties as happy as possible starting out. Sounds like a brewing experiment to me.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

an easy way to be sure your yeast is good and I would on any kit that could be shelved for years is the same old bread/rolls/pizza dough starter. just sanitize a pickle jar or anything with a sealed lid that size, add 50% distilled water then 1 teaspoon sugar with the yeast and shake it up till all is liquid pop the lid slightly and set it on the counter for 30 minutes or until 1/2 to 1 inch of foam appears and stays then pitch, make sure you don't mix it up to early and forget about it, Ive done that many times resulting in your jar overflowing

 

[Head First]

This part of this thread has probably run its course enough to ask a tangential question. Why do you suppose that Brewer's Best explicitely states in their instructions not to rehydrate, even though the included packet of yeast gives instructions for rehydrating?

Good question. Shoot them an email and ask the company?
Usually you can go by manufactures directions but when sold in kit and there is a conflict?
Personally I would question the Brewers Best choice to conflict with the manufacturer.
That's just me though.

 

[jeffpn]

Me too. In fact, long ago I used to rehydrate their yeast, against their instructions. (They alway include Safale or Saflager in everything they package.) when I did my first BIAB kit they used to sell, I called them and asked why they don't do a diacetyl rest. He said they found they never needed it. Maybe I'll call them with this question too, just out of curiosity.

 

[Nosybear]

Seems a reasonable approach! Let us know what you find out. But one caution: The answer, "I've never needed one" is kind of like the approach of not buying auto insurance because you've never had a wreck. While the consequences of a car crash are worse, I've tasted a lot of off-flavored beer that could have been caused by an underpitch. The difference between 100 billion viable cells and 200 billion is ultimately about 20 minutes (the time it takes a yeast population to double) and given enough oxygen, you may, most of the time, not run into trouble. Problem is, you don't know how old those yeast packs are or how viable the cells in them are. That's why I rehydrate and ultimately why I do a diacetyl rest: Insurance. It's one less generation of cells.

 

[jeffpn]

I see your point, but like you said, not having insurance can be catastrophic. Worst that can happen in brewing is the loss of a few bucks. To compare car insurance to not rehydrating or not doing a D rest really doesn't make sense, at least to me. I'm sure there are a host of things I could incorporate into my brewing process that may eliminate a rare problem some day. But if I never seem to have the problems, why bother? In the case of rehydrating, my batches usually finish with a lower gravity than intended anyway. Definitively not a risk.

 

[jeffpn]

Okay I just called them. The guy who answered is named Jeff, so I have to assume he knows what he's talking about! Actually, he seemed unaware that their instructions say not to rehydrate while the packs say to rehydrate. He thought maybe their instructions were printed a long time ago. I told him as long as I remember, their instructions have always said NOT to rehydrate, and that goes back a couple decades for me. Then he said there's always been a debate, and essentially I got a no answer. He said he'd get with their guys who write their instructions to have them clarify. Maybe time will tell.

 

[AsharaDayne]

Now that the rehydration conversation has run its course and I finally got around to brewing this, I thought I would post a quick update. The brew just finished the gurgle phase and should be clarifying now.
I had a bit of a boilover during the boil (be looking for a bigger kettle). After that things went smoothly enough. I wound up with an OG of 1.080 and FG of 1.015, which means I rather overshot my target, but hey. Belgian beers do tend to be have higher alcohol contents so it's all in the game (maybe I can dilute with a bit of water before bottling?).
As of now, the taste is definitely IPA, high bitterness, some pleasant aroma.
The brew's sitting on a thick cushion of hops and yeast sludge (be looking into ways of filtering out the hops for next time). Color is something like expected, a bit cloudy of course.
All in all, things are looking good.

 

[GFHomebrew]

They like to keep us thinking

 

[Nosybear]

The yeast isn't a problem - it won't start to autolyze and throw off flavors for a couple of months at least. It's the hop debris I worry about in my beers so I've started bagging them in the boil. Bag, use a hop spider, anything to keep the plant matter out of the fermentor. Then your trub should be mostly protein and dead yeast, neither of which have very strong flavors.

 

[AsharaDayne]

Bag, use a hop spider, anything to keep the plant matter out of the fermentor

I'm looking into this. Haven't found a solution yet that convinces me entirely.
From what I've gathered, letting the gunk in for fermentation isn't that much of a problem. But for future brews, I do intend to get rid of the hops residue.

 

[GFHomebrew]

Okay I just called them. The guy who answered is named Jeff, so I have to assume he knows what he's talking about! Actually, he seemed unaware that their instructions say not to rehydrate while the packs say to rehydrate. He thought maybe their instructions were printed a long time ago. I told him as long as I remember, their instructions have always said NOT to rehydrate, and that goes back a couple decades for me. Then he said there's always been a debate, and essentially I got a no answer. He said he'd get with their guys who write their instructions to have them clarify. Maybe time will tell.

Yea right that's him fobbing you off jeffpn. But who knows stranger things have happened no offence meant there jeff but yea that means to me yea yea mate will do as soon as possible click.

 

[Nosybear]

I found a way to build a redneck hop spider recently. As soon as I can get it sent, I'll attach it. Roughly, it's two rods held in place by binder clips with a hop bag held to the rods with, you guessed it, binder clips. Total investment is less than five dollars. I think I found the idea on Homebrew Talk.... Well, I WOULD upload it but I'm getting the spectacularly unhelpful error message "There was a problem uploading your file" when I try.

 

[GFHomebrew]

I reduce the size of the photo by cutting just what you want out and sending that file size.
Hop spider is on my diy list Nosey so don't hold back big fella

 

[Nosybear]

I reduced the file size.... Will try again! And still no bueno. I'm saving it to my Google drive and will try again this evening when I'm not on a work-regulated computer.

 

[AsharaDayne]

Just want to give another update now that the brew has had time to mature.
Didn't turn out quite like I wanted: it's way stronger and a bit darker than anticipated. But I'm very taken with it all the same.
There's a depth and richness of taste that I didn't expect and find just wonderful. I think the T-58 yeast and the hops used really worked well together. It might not be balanced or sutble, I never was known for my fine palate - put it does me just fine.

It's quite encouraging and I can't wait to brew some more stuff. I'm torn between attempting to recreate this and the desire to use local hops from Europe. But anyhow, the experiment was a success.

 

[GFHomebrew]

Glad to hear mate

 

[J A]

Didn't turn out quite like I wanted: it's way stronger and a bit darker than anticipated. But I'm very taken with it all the same.
There's a depth and richness of taste that I didn't expect and find just wonderful.

What recipe did you end up with? I think you were going to use light DME./LME, but what hop schedule did you use in the end?

 

[AsharaDayne]

What recipe did you end up with? I think you were going to use light DME./LME, but what hop schedule did you use in the end?

I did use light DME, plus some cane sugar. I boiled Magnum for an hour and added Glacier for aroma in the end. The long boil and the cane sugar might account for the darker than expected coloring, I guess.