Thinking about changing from Electric to Gas

[AHarper]

Due to the ever increasing cost of energy here I am on the brink of changing over to a gas boiler and new kettle and I am after hearing the experiences of all you Gas users out there.

Is it economical? How long can I expect 15kg of gas (Butane) to last? Yes I know it's almost to gauge it accurately as it depends on how high you turn it up and for how long it's on but realistically what is the ball-park? Forty 60 minute boils? More? Less? I have no experience of what it takes so I would welcome ideas based on your experience.

My current system is base on two boilers. One (20lt @2kW) I put on at the start of the brew day to get hot water to clean and sterilise equipment. The other (25lt @ 3kW) I put on to heat the strike water, Sparge water while the mash is under way and then the 60 (or, occasionally, 90 minute) boil. So all told I could use about 6 to 8 kW/Hrs about £4 - £5 per brew day.

A 15kg refill of Butane costs around £50 here.

My financial adviser (Mrs H!) has given the green light on buying the new kit - approx £300 if I can wangle in the new extra bits of pipework, clamps etc and the kettle and burner but running costs are the big talking point. I have to cut back on all the fridges etc I must admin just run day after day even when no brew is in them - well I may want to brew at the drop of a hat and I can't wait for fridges to chill - the weather might change or I may go fishing etc.

Switching to gas may be a cheaper option than the electric boilers I just don't. That's why I'm posting this... advice (or an excuse to go gas and get a bigger boiler I wouldn't have otherwise have an excuse to buy!)

 

[GFHomebrew]

Well Allan I get your dilemma electricity here has increased 100% if not more.

My only saving grace is my 6.4kw solar system on my roof.
From 10-2 I can easy run my 3.3kw element for nothing that's if I time it right.

So I'd also think about solar but I understand a sunny day can be hard to come by.

Little interesting point Australia has the biggest roof top solar uptake in the world.

(Actually Singapore is building a solar farm in Nothern Territory and gunna sink a big under sea cable back all the way back over there I guess to achieve their c02 immersions target ). "G20 Target "
And in Aus Sunshine Coast is one of the leaders in roof top solar installations.
Yeah OK you don't care lol I just thought I'd give a fist pump to my little region of the world .


Good luck mate I went the reverse from LPG gas to Electric it was a huge saving windy days don't matter on Electric also bottles don't run out half way through the boil.
And you can control temps precisely.

 

[Zambi]

Might not help you much, but 15 kg lasts me about 2-3 months and that's for all my cooking (incl of small beer batches).
If you do go to gas, get 2 bottles. So when tge first bottle runs out, you don't have to run to the filling station immediately.
I'm desperately waiting for my extra solar panels, so I can use my 2.2 kw electric kettle (hopefully)

 

[Steve SPF]

I brew on gas and did this costing quite early on.

The actual gas content on our bottles is 13kg, I think the whole package weighs around 27kg from memory. I brew on a 100lt kit and do 60 minute boils, typical starting volume is 85lt. Our gas cost has increased signiicantly, same as everything else, but generally speaking we get 6 or 7 brews from a cylinder and the cylinder costs us £40-42 at the moment.

I got a couple of new vessels last week so will be bumping up to someting like 120lt batches with, presumably, bumped up gas consumption. I'll let you know.

We will scale next year (hopefully) and will be forced to go electric because gas just won't be enough.

 

[Donoroto]

One downside is that a gas flame has its hazards, not just from burning down the house but Carbon Monoxide venting.

That being said, many of my local mates use gas (propane here) and having the flexibility to gas or electric as the whim strikes is an advantage. A tank is good for several 10 gallon 1 hour boils, but I can't say exactly how much.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

I brew with a combination of electric and gas. I plan on going all electric. In the US, electricity is cheaper than brewing with propane. Like Don mentioned, no open flame and no exhaust from a flame is the main advantage of electric. Even if gas were cheaper, I would go with electric, you never have to worry about a tank going empty during the brew.

 

[Minbari]

My preference, but i like electric. Can more easily vary temp with multiple elements and PWM

 

[Box of Rocks]

Curious whether you have investigated induction burners. I use one, and it works great, but am targeting 4 gallon batches.
Increased efficiency, although I haven't seen any 220v (or larger) versions for bigger vessels.
[Might be a great kickstarter campaign - fund a custom-size induction burner that runs on 220v, with appropriate timers, specifically for boiling enough grain to end up with 10 gallons in kegs.]

 

[Nosybear]

I use induction burners - very efficient but they require electricity, which I believe has also gone up in price. We have rooftop solar but it doesn't provide 100% of our electricity - weird Colorado law about being taxed as an electrical utility if we produce more than we use. I like the induction units - no scorching, little waste heat, good control over the boil. Something to consider. As to the appropriate size, a 3500 watt unit (requires 220V) makes all the heat I need to boil my five and six gallon batches.

 

[GFHomebrew]

That would put a halt on large roof top solar installations.
Crazy!

 

[Bubba Wade]

You should run a cost analysis. If you have a working electric system, I'm guessing you will need to brew a LOT of batches before the incremental cost of the electricity offsets the purchase price of the new gas equipment.

Now, to be fair, I live in an area where both electricity and propane are fairly cheap compared to the rest of the world. But I suspect payback will take some time.

On the other hand, using energy costs to justify a new system to a spouse is perfectly acceptable.

 

[Herm brews]

I use induction burners - very efficient but they require electricity, which I believe has also gone up in price. We have rooftop solar but it doesn't provide 100% of our electricity - weird Colorado law about being taxed as an electrical utility if we produce more than we use. I like the induction units - no scorching, little waste heat, good control over the boil. Something to consider. As to the appropriate size, a 3500 watt unit (requires 220V) makes all the heat I need to boil my five and six gallon batches.

Good info, thanks @Nosybear
I just moved from SoCal (gas utility) to Eugene, OR (all electric). The one batch brewed on the electric stove went surprisingly well, except for the steam in the kitchen. Even with my vent hood fan at full force, there was excessive condensation under the hood, with the resultant dripping. I was able to towel mop most of the drips, but felt distracted trying to prevent the drips into my kettle. I like the idea of using an induction cooktop in my garage during the winter, and out on my deck during warmer seasons. My smaller 2.5 gallon batches might allow for an 1800 watt induction cooktop.

 

[Bubba Wade]

Good info, thanks @Nosybear
I just moved from SoCal (gas utility) to Eugene, OR (all electric). The one batch brewed on the electric stove went surprisingly well, except for the steam in the kitchen. Even with my vent hood fan at full force, there was excessive condensation under the hood, with the resultant dripping. I was able to towel mop most of the drips, but felt distracted trying to prevent the drips into my kettle. I like the idea of using an induction cooktop in my garage during the winter, and out on my deck during warmer seasons. My smaller 2.5 gallon batches might allow for an 1800 watt induction cooktop.

I brew 2.5 gallon batches with a 1600 watt system, although it’s not induction. Works pretty well and heats fairly quickly. I evaporate roughly a quart during a 30 minute boil.

 

[Herm brews]

I brew 2.5 gallon batches with a 1600 watt system, although it’s not induction. Works pretty well and heats fairly quickly. I evaporate roughly a quart during a 30 minute boil.

My wife keeps suggesting that I get an electric all in one, but I counter with “What will I do with the 3 and 5.5 gallon kettles” that I already have.
On another note, the environmentally conscious neighborhood that we live in is striving to be fossil fuel free, so around here, electric is the way to go. Surprisingly, here in the rainy PNW, there is quite a bit of solar, both rooftop and large scale field generation.

 

[Sandy Feet]

Found this online. I used a calculator until I got a feel for the usage on my little 15 lb LP container.
Propane Usage & Tank Size Calculator - How Long Will Your Tank Last? - Towing Home

 

[Bubba Wade]

My wife keeps suggesting that I get an electric all in one, but I counter with “What will I do with the 3 and 5.5 gallon kettles” that I already have.
On another note, the environmentally conscious neighborhood that we live in is striving to be fossil fuel free, so around here, electric is the way to go. Surprisingly, here in the rainy PNW, there is quite a bit of solar, both rooftop and large scale field generation.

I’ve been using a Gigawort electric vessel for the last four years. It’s a 4 gallon vessel and marketed towards extract brewers. However, I found that it is the perfect size for 2.5 gallon BIAB. I also bought a 9” round wire cake cooling rack to put in the bottom so that the grain bag does hit the heating element during the mash. All in all, it works pretty well.

 

[Nosybear]

I brew 2.5 gallon batches with a 1600 watt system, although it’s not induction. Works pretty well and heats fairly quickly. I evaporate roughly a quart during a 30 minute boil.

I have a 1600 watt induction unit I use as a side burner. Damn, it heats water fast!

 

[Nosybear]

Good info, thanks @Nosybear
I just moved from SoCal (gas utility) to Eugene, OR (all electric). The one batch brewed on the electric stove went surprisingly well, except for the steam in the kitchen. Even with my vent hood fan at full force, there was excessive condensation under the hood, with the resultant dripping. I was able to towel mop most of the drips, but felt distracted trying to prevent the drips into my kettle. I like the idea of using an induction cooktop in my garage during the winter, and out on my deck during warmer seasons. My smaller 2.5 gallon batches might allow for an 1800 watt induction cooktop.

That size will work fine for smaller batches.

 

[RoadRoach]

Alan, I'm going the opposite direction. As for efficiency with propane, a lot of that is going to depend on your burner size and a few other factors such as the size of the bottom of the kettle (how much heat goes around the kettle and does nothing), wind, batch size, etc, etc. A lotta variables just simply go away with electric, particularly on the mashing steps. Boiling is boiling. Doesn't really matter what you heat with then. But gas is VERY hard to control mashing temperature with, especially if have a burner as big as mine. I think mine's something like 400,000 BTU, so asking me about efficiency of a propane bottle is sort like asking a top fuel drag racer what kinda mileage he gets. The answer's pretty simple, "NOT GOOD". My primary reason for going electric (or hybrid) is control. With gas, you have to sit by the pot and constantly diddle with the regulator to control the flame when mashing. With electric, a temperature controller will do wonders coupled with a simple hot plate

 

[Good_brew]

I have both and brew almost exclusively on Electric. Having to go get some propane refills added a step to the brew process that I do not miss. The other thing to understand is immersion electric and induction are extremely efficient. A lot of heat from my huge Propane burner goes outside the kettle. With electric the element is in the liquid and the heat is retained and transferred. I still hold onto my burners but have not used them in several years. As others said a PID controlled electric mash is predictable as can be. Boiling is a toss up. I built a digital boil controller that gives me perfect control over the boil heat. I do miss the romance of the open flame. The other issue is brewing in a field with others does not work with electric but if you are home and have the hookups, no contest.