Using a "hop-back" inline whilst boiling.

[JuzzTF]

Hello all,
I've been building a new home brewery for myself and have been pretty set on putting in the hops whilst boiling in the past. However, with this new build came an idea. I am aware of the use of a hop-back whilst draining into the fermentor. However, my idea would be to use the hop-back as a container to hold the hops and to continually pump the boiling wort through this.

Not sure if anyone has done it before, but I'm sure someone out there has. Please have a look at the picture below, the blue container sitting on top of the beige pump. (The plan is to have two of these, one each side mirrored). It does look a bit of a mess as I have been taking it apart, after not working on it for a year, to re-build it properly.

Any comments on if you think this would be efficient and wouldn't lead to too much AA extraction?

Kind Regards

Justin

 

[CRUNK]

Correct my if I'm wrong, blichmann makes the hop rocket, I believe it works in the same fashion, so your plan should work just fine, as it's nearly identical to a hop rocket, keep us updated please, I concidered purchasing a hop rocket to keep more solid material out of my boil kettle.

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

your pump wont survive boiling temps, it will eventually shut off and those plastic fittings either, if your gong to try this your will need all stainless fittings and pump head

 

[CRUNK]

Great point Ozark, my pump head is ss, and all my fittings are also.

 

[nzbrew]

From the Blichmann 'hop rocket' info :

* The HopRocket™ can be utilized as a general strainer/filter, but it is not intended to filter all the sediment and particles of your brew kettle when used as a hopback. The large quantities of pellet hops, trub, and other debris will eventually plug and compact the hop-bed, stopping flow. Installing a pre-filter in your pot is recommended to prevent excessive quantities of material from entering the hopback. That said, filling the HopRocket with rice hulls does greatly increase the filtering capability of the product.

If you do get this working, I would be interested to hear how it goes. I can't see that you would get any more extraction than the hops being loose in the boil, would you just use this for the first (60 / 90 min hops)?

 

[Ozarks Mountain Brewery]

Ive experimented with what your talking about and your going to get more hop flavor at lower temperatures so using the hop rocket or similar should be done after cooling right into the kettle, thats the way breweries do it

 

[KC]

Reminds me of a system Kai mentions the Germans using that had a device called a grant. The grant was something like your hopback and heated wort over hops at 95 degrees to get the acid extraction. Their filter was set up a little differently and their system replaced the boil entirely. But you might be able to replicate those results with your setup; it would be similar to FWH.

 

[GFHomebrew]

So it sounds like this "hop back" is for the transfer of the cooled wort into the fermentor at the end of the boil eh? Them pumps would be working plenty sending the wort through that hop sludge. It must have some good filter screens in it.
Mate I'm a KISS Brewer for now that's Keep it Simple Stupid. Good luck though and hope to hear how you go with it Juzztf.

 

[CRUNK]

Thank you for the correction nzbrew I would be interested in taking a look a this grant system you mentioned in your post. Do you have a few links?

 

[JuzzTF]

your pump wont survive boiling temps, it will eventually shut off and those plastic fittings either, if your gong to try this your will need all stainless fittings and pump head

Pumps and fittings are plastic but rated to 110c (220f) used for solar hot water systems. I've used pumps like this before for boiling in an old homebrew system I made a while back, the containers also seem to hold boiling water well.

 

[JuzzTF]

I

So it sounds like this "hop back" is for the transfer of the cooled wort into the fermentor at the end of the boil eh? Them pumps would be working plenty sending the wort through that hop sludge. It must have some good filter screens in it.
Mate I'm a KISS Brewer for now that's Keep it Simple Stupid. Good luck though and hope to hear how you go with it Juzztf.

I have a two system screen on both ends of the containers, a very fine SS mesh inside the caps of the containers and a filter sponge used in aquarium filters to reduce sludge. Hopefully this I'll work but at the end of the day it's all experimental. Only brewing about 4 imperial gallons at a time so fingers crossed.

 

[KC]

I would be interested in taking a look a this grant system you mentioned in your post. Do you have a few links?

I've saw it on the translated braukaiser history page, but it's buried so here's the text:

When the hops are boiled one gets the extract but the essential oils escape. So it would be logical not to boil the wort. This is possible because proteins already coagulate before boiling temperatures. Just look at the way good coffee or tee is made. It is known that boiling the coffee or tea ruins it and that a good coffee or tee is only steeped in hot water.

It is difficult to understand that this commonly known practice can also be used for hops and a Herr Tizard has to come along to show the brewers the light and sell them an open secret as new. Tizard's process works as follows:

Below the mash tun is the so called grant which collects the wort run off from the mash. This grant gets a perforated bottom. Close to the actual bottom is copper tubing through which boiling steam is run. The hops are placed on top of this tubing and are covered with a perforated plate to prevent it from floating up. Steam is run through the pipes as soon as the grant is half full in order to heat the wort and keep it at 95 C. Now wort is slowly drawn from the grant and new wort from the mash enters the grant. The flow rates are matched and adjusted such that the wort inside the grant remains at 95 C. The pump with draws the wort from the grant reaches under the perforated plate and the opening of this pipe is covered with a mesh to hold back the hops. New wort is always coming into contact with the hops through this mechanism.

This is an interesting concept indeed. It sounds like first wort hopping with a hop back right after the mash tun and I assume that they didn't worry about not boiling off DMS with the use of this no boil practice. Or maybe the DMS is later evaporated on the cool ship and “Berieslungskuehler” (see wort cooling for an explanation of this device). This is the first time I read about such a hopping method and I doubt that it was commonly used.

Tizard was British so I looked up his own writing in English, and he calls it the "Hop Convertor." Described in this book from 1850 beginning on page 234. He drains the mash into a tub. The tub has a false bottom; hops line the top of the false bottom, and steam pipes are inside the false bottom. Wort fills the converter where it's heated with steam to 200°F and is drawn through the hops out the false bottom to cooling tanks.

 

[CRUNK]

I would be willing to experiment with that process, thank you for the information.

I always looking for ways to improve my process in order to achieve better results, and end product.