Star San

[JoshuaGates]

Hey Y'all,

Brand new member and happy to be here!

I've done about 20 batches of kits (extract mostly) and I'm going to get into BIAB very soon. I've already purchased everything I need.

Quick Question:

Premise: So before I bottle, I always use my trusty sanatizing tool that funnels Star San into the bottle. Immediately after sanatizing, I fill the bottle and cap it. I feel like I'm getting a taste from the Star San. A lot of my IPA brews have a very similar "taste" to them, even though they are very different recipes. The only constant is the Star San process.

Question: Is it possible that the Star San is giving off this taste? Or, should I sanatize and allow the bottles to dry before filling/capping? Or, should I be doing something completely different?

FYI: All my beer tastes good, they all just have that one similar taste "trait".

Look forward to some expert help on this one.

Thanks!

 

[Megary]

Unless you’re leaving a lot of Star San behind my opinion is no, the taste you are experiencing is not from your sanitizing method.

Can you explain the “taste”? Personally, I find a lot of IPA’s taste the same no matter the hops used. Then again, my taste buds aren’t the best.

 

[Minbari]

Not likely. Starsan is just acid and water. As long as you are using clean bottles and starsan, then emptied.

How would you describe it?

Since you are moving to a grain brewing process, it might not be worth troubleshooting too much until you have a batch of that.

What kind of fermenter?
How do you clean it?
Do you use a secondary?
What precautions do you take against oxygenation? (Can be important for hoppy beers)
Is there ever any scorch on the boil kettle?

 

[Megary]

Not likely. Starsan is just acid and water. As long as you are using clean bottles and starsan, then emptied.

How would you describe it?

Since you are moving to a grain brewing process, it might not be worth troubleshooting too much until you have a batch of that.

What kind of fermenter?
How do you clean it?
Do you use a secondary?
What precautions do you take against oxygenation? (Can be important for hoppy beers)
Is there ever any scorch on the boil kettle?

+1

And, what is your water source? If you are using tap water without removing the chlorine, well…that will certainly leave a “taste” behind, no matter the beer style.

One other possibility, I‘ve heard tales of a certain “tang” that comes from using liquid extract past its prime.

 

[BarbarianBrewer]

When bottling I usually clean and sanitize them the night before. I invert them on a bottling tree. The chance of anything nasty getting into an inverted, freshly sanitized bottle is extremely unlikely.

Another possibility on the off-taste is oxidation during bottling. It's hard to avoid.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

Yeast has a "flavor". A lot of breweries have a house yeast and house flavor. Hell, I have a house flavor! That could be an explanation. But if you are mixing the Starsan properly, you will get no flavor from it.

 

[Ward Chillington]

Another possibility on the off-taste is oxidation during bottling. It's hard to avoid

Especially in a highly hopped IPA!

Otherwise...more data please... and welcome!

 

[Donoroto]

Hey Y'all,

Brand new member and happy to be here!

I've done about 20 batches of kits (extract mostly) and I'm going to get into BIAB very soon. I've already purchased everything I need.

Quick Question:

Premise: So before I bottle, I always use my trusty sanatizing tool that funnels Star San into the bottle. Immediately after sanatizing, I fill the bottle and cap it. I feel like I'm getting a taste from the Star San. A lot of my IPA brews have a very similar "taste" to them, even though they are very different recipes. The only constant is the Star San process.

Question: Is it possible that the Star San is giving off this taste? Or, should I sanatize and allow the bottles to dry before filling/capping? Or, should I be doing something completely different?

FYI: All my beer tastes good, they all just have that one similar taste "trait".

Look forward to some expert help on this one.

Thanks!

As noted, probably not.
Try a small taste of mixed StarSan. You'll find it really has no flavor.

One possibility would be to let the freshly sanitized bottle drip upside down for the 2 minutes contact time they recommend. If there are more than 2 or 3 drops left in the bottle I'd be surprised.

Any homebrew store nearby, or a brewing club, or perhaps a smaller craft brewery? You'd find people who really know beer there, and perhaps they can offer some ideas as to the taste you're getting. Could be many things, possibly related to your process.

Anyway: Welcome, and as you can see, we're all happy to help however we can!

 

[Craigerrr]

I will +1 on starsan not causing your "flavor".
Good call by @Megary on the chlorine.
If you are using municipal water it will have chlorine, or chloromine.

Copied for the Canadian Homebrewers Association Site:

Chlorophenols specifically make plastic, Band-Aid, and medicinal flavours. Chlorophenols are formed by the presence of chlorine and chloramine in your brewing water that bond to natural phenolic compounds that yeast produce during fermentation. The yeast binds these phenols to the chlorine compounds as a way to protect themselves, which is smart, but leaves us with a pretty undesirable taste.

 

[Donoroto]

Chlorine and chloramine are removed easily by brewers using either sodium metabisulfate (SMB) or potassium metabisulfate (PMB), often sold as "Campden Tablets". A half tablet (maybe 1/4 gram) is good for 5-10 gallons of water, and the effect is nearly instantaneous, like a second or three. Also inexpensive.

Chlorine can be removed other ways, but chloramine is more difficult.

 

[JoshuaGates]

Wow! Y'all are awesome! Thanks so much for the knowledge.

I am using municipal water, but I filter it through a Brita filter before using. Is that not good enough? Naturally, I've read a million posts about it, and the consensus seemed to be that the filtered water is good enough. Also, our municipal water some of the best in my region. I know that's a loaded statement, but it's true.

@Donoroto, I did taste a small sample of properly mixed StarSan, and you're right. There's not much taste there at all, and it certainly can't be contributed to what I'm tasting in my beers.

My gut is telling me it's the water.

@Minbari : here's the answer to your questions.

What kind of fermenter? I have a plastic conical fermenter. Fast Fermenter.
How do you clean it? I use PBW to clean everything. (after a brew, and of course, before a brew).
Do you use a secondary? I have two wide mouth plastic carboys, but I do not use them for secondary, because my fermenter has a ball valve that I can shut off. I've read that this is the best way to do it to avoid oxydation during secondary transfer.
What precautions do you take against oxygenation? (Can be important for hoppy beers). I guess I'm a noob on this one. I do my best to avoid oxydation at every turn.
Is there ever any scorch on the boil kettle? Never. I clean my equipment very thoroughly.

My next post is going to be about my equipment. I think I've done a good job curating my gear (some used, some brand new), but I am definitely looking forward to some feedback.

 

[Sunfire96]

Wow! Y'all are awesome! Thanks so much for the knowledge.

I am using municipal water, but I filter it through a Brita filter before using. Is that not good enough? Naturally, I've read a million posts about it, and the consensus seemed to be that the filtered water is good enough. Also, our municipal water some of the best in my region. I know that's a loaded statement, but it's true.

@Donoroto, I did taste a small sample of properly mixed StarSan, and you're right. There's not much taste there at all, and it certainly can't be contributed to what I'm tasting in my beers.

My gut is telling me it's the water.

@Minbari : here's the answer to your questions.

What kind of fermenter? I have a plastic conical fermenter. Fast Fermenter.
How do you clean it? I use PBW to clean everything. (after a brew, and of course, before a brew).
Do you use a secondary? I have two wide mouth plastic carboys, but I do not use them for secondary, because my fermenter has a ball valve that I can shut off. I've read that this is the best way to do it to avoid oxydation during secondary transfer.
What precautions do you take against oxygenation? (Can be important for hoppy beers). I guess I'm a noob on this one. I do my best to avoid oxydation at every turn.
Is there ever any scorch on the boil kettle? Never. I clean my equipment very thoroughly.

My next post is going to be about my equipment. I think I've done a good job curating my gear (some used, some brand new), but I am definitely looking forward to some feedback.

Chloramine is designed to be incredibly stable in water. Filtering won't remove it. It must be removed chemically with campden tablets

 

[Minbari]

Wow! Y'all are awesome! Thanks so much for the knowledge.

I am using municipal water, but I filter it through a Brita filter before using. Is that not good enough? Naturally, I've read a million posts about it, and the consensus seemed to be that the filtered water is good enough. Also, our municipal water some of the best in my region. I know that's a loaded statement, but it's true.

@Donoroto, I did taste a small sample of properly mixed StarSan, and you're right. There's not much taste there at all, and it certainly can't be contributed to what I'm tasting in my beers.

My gut is telling me it's the water.

@Minbari : here's the answer to your questions.

What kind of fermenter? I have a plastic conical fermenter. Fast Fermenter.
How do you clean it? I use PBW to clean everything. (after a brew, and of course, before a brew).
Do you use a secondary? I have two wide mouth plastic carboys, but I do not use them for secondary, because my fermenter has a ball valve that I can shut off. I've read that this is the best way to do it to avoid oxydation during secondary transfer.
What precautions do you take against oxygenation? (Can be important for hoppy beers). I guess I'm a noob on this one. I do my best to avoid oxydation at every turn.
Is there ever any scorch on the boil kettle? Never. I clean my equipment very thoroughly.

My next post is going to be about my equipment. I think I've done a good job curating my gear (some used, some brand new), but I am definitely looking forward to some feedback.

All answers sound perfect. Being vigilant to avoid oxygen exposure POST fermentation is the important part.

Only thing i would investigate would be the brita pots ability to remove chlorine and chloramine.(and to what extent) it might be worth it to just throw a camden tablet in your mash water before brewing. They are cheap and work nearly instantly. Those two chemicals are cause for chlorophenols which is a medicinal and/ or bandaid flavour in beer

 

[Donoroto]

Wow! Y'all are awesome! Thanks so much for the knowledge.

I am using municipal water, but I filter it through a Brita filter before using. Is that not good enough? Naturally, I've read a million posts about it, and the consensus seemed to be that the filtered water is good enough. Also, our municipal water some of the best in my region. I know that's a loaded statement, but it's true.

@Donoroto, I did taste a small sample of properly mixed StarSan, and you're right. There's not much taste there at all, and it certainly can't be contributed to what I'm tasting in my beers.

My gut is telling me it's the water.

@Minbari : here's the answer to your questions.

What kind of fermenter? I have a plastic conical fermenter. Fast Fermenter.
How do you clean it? I use PBW to clean everything. (after a brew, and of course, before a brew).
Do you use a secondary? I have two wide mouth plastic carboys, but I do not use them for secondary, because my fermenter has a ball valve that I can shut off. I've read that this is the best way to do it to avoid oxydation during secondary transfer.
What precautions do you take against oxygenation? (Can be important for hoppy beers). I guess I'm a noob on this one. I do my best to avoid oxydation at every turn.
Is there ever any scorch on the boil kettle? Never. I clean my equipment very thoroughly.

My next post is going to be about my equipment. I think I've done a good job curating my gear (some used, some brand new), but I am definitely looking forward to some feedback.

A Brita filter does not reduce Chloramine. But some SMB or PMB. If you have a brew store near, you might spend just a few dollars.

Once you want to really get into water profiles, we can talk about that. For the most part, other than chloramine, it does not matter that much.

 

[GDubs]

Josh,

It sounds like I am 6-9 months ahead of you on the learning curve.

I did a bunch of extract kits on my stove top before making the switch to BIAB. The first real game changer for me when I was doing extracts was going from partial boils to full volume boils. Prior to that, my partial boil brews all took on a similar malty note that I have attributed to a caramelization of the super concentrated wort, even though I had been careful not to scorch the bottom of my kettle.

The second big improvement for me, especially with IPA's, was adding an immersion chiller to my process. The ability to QUICKLY cool the wort preserves the flavor and aroma compounds that can be muted or lost if the wort stays hot for too long.... resulting in IPAs that are a little more bitter and a little less "brite". The kits could do better job of explaining how you might alter late hop additions based on your set up.

Lastly, oxygen will rob your IPA's of their individual character as well. For this reason, I have taken to fermenting IPA's directly in my bottling bucket and using carbonation drops instead of transferring to a secondary or a bottling bucket with priming sugar. Your first and last bottle of beer are going to be a little yeasty but fewer transfers should equate to less opportunity for oxygen to get into your beer.

Cheers!

 

[wallyLOZ]

Another option would be to "build" your own water starting with either RO or distilled. Add brewing salts according to a water calculator such as EZ Water Calculator, free online. I struggled with the bandaid taste for several batches until I switched to distilled. It provided instant results and I've been using distilled since. Good luck and keep us posted on your progress.

 

[Minbari]

Another option would be to "build" your own water starting with either RO or distilled. Add brewing salts according to a water calculator such as EZ Water Calculator, free online. I struggled with the bandaid taste for several batches until I switched to distilled. It provided instant results and I've been using distilled since. Good luck and keep us posted on your progress.

Exactly how I do it. Ezwater is ossum

 

[richbon]

+1 on the RO/Distilled water approach. I had a similar issue with a recurring hard to describe taste/aroma. I was using my fridge filtered water (basic carbon filter - probably similar to Brita). The "taste" went away for me when I switched to supermarket distilled water and then added my own salts to create a water profile. If nothing else, using RO/distilled will help you eliminate that as a possible cause.

I don't know if there's any science to back this up, but my thought is that there may be some some residual chlorine left after filtering that is below the taste threshold that could then form chlorophenols during brewing that has a lower taste threshold than chlorine alone. My muni water supplier doesn't use chloramines.

 

[Minbari]

+1 on the RO/Distilled water approach. I had a similar issue with a recurring hard to describe taste/aroma. I was using my fridge filtered water (basic carbon filter - probably similar to Brita). The "taste" went away for me when I switched to supermarket distilled water and then added my own salts to create a water profile. If nothing else, using RO/distilled will help you eliminate that as a possible cause.

I don't know if there's any science to back this up, but my thought is that may be some some residual chlorine left after filtering that is below the taste threshold than then forms chlorophenols after brewing that has a lower taste threshold than chlorine alone. My muni water supplier doesn't use chloramines.

Exactly what happens.

An RO filter will get rid of it and camden tablets will get rid of it

 

[Semper Sitientem]

Any kind of water filter meant to eliminate chlorine will reduce 95%+ Instantly. The remaining <5% is probably negligible. Also, chlorine evaporates fairly rapidly when left in an open container. My practice is to fill my AIO the night before and leave it open. But, for cheap insurance I do add a 1/2 campden tablet.