RO Water Users?

[The Brew Mentor]

I just had an RO system installed at my home and plan to use it in my Home Brewing when I eventually start to brew at home again.
What I'm reading is telling me that when RO water is exposed to Oxygen, that the pH range can be as low as 5-5.5.
For those using RO water, what have you found to be the case? What pH are you using and what are the resulting pH measurements?
Without actually testing it with a meter at this point, I'd like to get a starting point.
Also, any other things I should be looking out for?
Cheers,
Brian
Oh, and it only took one sip of my morning coffee to decide I won't use it for that! Haha

 

[Minbari]

I just had an RO system installed at my home and plan to use it in my Home Brewing when I eventually start to brew at home again.
What I'm reading is telling me that when RO water is exposed to Oxygen, that the pH range can be as low as 5-5.5.
For those using RO water, what have you found to be the case? What pH are you using and what are the resulting pH measurements?
Without actually testing it with a meter at this point, I'd like to get a starting point.
Also, any other things I should be looking out for?
Cheers,
Brian
Oh, and it only took one sip of my morning coffee to decide I won't use it for that! Haha

Never had an issue with pH. Once i add grains and whatever salts i am gonna use, it is usually spot on.

I will have to grab my meter and see what it says.

As for things to look out for, you will have to adjust the profile. Straight RO water really has very little of anything in it

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Never had an issue with pH. Once i add grains and whatever salts i am gonna use, it is usually spot on.

I will have to grab my meter and see what it says.

As for things to look out for, you will have to adjust the profile. Straight RO water really has very little of anything in it

So are you just using the water calculator here, selecting RO water and then building on that?
I wasn't sure how the water calc would deal with an unknown pH?

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

I use RO water and supplement it with distilled water (it’s easier to grab a couple of gallons of distilled water when I’m in the store). I treat both the same with no noticeable difference in the beer.
As far as water pH is concerned, I don’t believe it’s even worth checking because the buffering capacity of RO is very low, distilled is even lower. The smallest amount of a base or acid move the pH easily. The alkalinity of RO water is 10-15ppm, almost as low as distilled water, which is 0ppm in theory. It’s pretty much a blank slate.
The only problem you may have is that the pH will drop too low with dark grains because RO water has almost no alkalinity to prevent the darker grain from dropping the pH. It’s perfect water for lighter beers, including IPA’s/PA.
I still use all RO water for darker beers, but I found the pH drops too low. So I adjust with sodium bicarbonate and calcium hydroxide (pickling lime).

 

[Minbari]

So are you just using the water calculator here, selecting RO water and then building on that?
I wasn't sure how the water calc would deal with an unknown pH?

I use EZwater spreadsheet. it doesnt account for PH, but it does alow you to biuld the RO profile (which prolly give it the PH factor)

once you add your salts to finished profile, it tells you what the PH will be as well as sulfate ratio

edit: @The Brew Mentor my RO water PH is 6.8

 

[west1m]

I also use RO water. The first time I made Bunyip it called for a bit of Phosphoric acid so I added a few ounces of acid malt . The PH of the mash was a bit 5ish low. This time I did not add the acid malt and the PH came out 5.2ish

 

[Donoroto]

What @HighVoltageMan! said: the pH is irrelevant, the RO water has almost zero buffering capacity. This means even a drop of, say, vinegar in a gallon will move the pH a lot. Compared to the pH effects of the malt, RO water can be ignored as far as pH goes.

Like distilled water, it does not taste great either. Needs minerals.

 

[Minbari]

What @HighVoltageMan! said: the pH is irrelevant, the RO water has almost zero buffering capacity. This means even a drop of, say, vinegar in a gallon will move the pH a lot. Compared to the pH effects of the malt, RO water can be ignored as far as pH goes.

Like distilled water, it does not taste great either. Needs minerals.

it does make a nice clean slate to make what you like.

 

[Buckeye Hydro]

It is exposure to CO2, rather than oxygen that lowers the pH of RO water. And as mentioned above, the pH of RO water is irrelevant as it has no buffers and changes pH very very easily.

Russ

 

[The Brew Mentor]

What @HighVoltageMan! said: the pH is irrelevant, the RO water has almost zero buffering capacity. This means even a drop of, say, vinegar in a gallon will move the pH a lot. Compared to the pH effects of the malt, RO water can be ignored as far as pH goes.

Like distilled water, it does not taste great either. Needs minerals.

So no acid in the sparge water?

 

[Donoroto]

So no acid in the sparge water?

Hardly need it.

I mean, try it: plain old RO water, heated to sparge temps, poured over a grain bed. Measure the runoff pH. Any pH effects for the water will be overwhelmed by several orders of magnitude by the grain pH.

Non-RO water is different, and it can have a significant buffering effect. But RO is essentially mineral-free.

 

[Yooper]

I use RO water, and it's true that the pH will drop due to contact with room air and no buffering. I've never seen it drop to 5, but I guess it's theoretically possible.

I use 100% RO to sparge, as since it has no alkalinity the pH doesn't actually matter.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Interesting for sure and a new journey when I get there.
The first few batches will be full of measurements and notes I'm sure but hopefully I'll dial it in quickly.
The RO water was the first piece I put in place for the retirement system, I think the next will be the brew house with moisture recovery.
Thanks all!

 

[GFHomebrew]

Interesting for sure and a new journey when I get there.
The first few batches will be full of measurements and notes I'm sure but hopefully I'll dial it in quickly.
The RO water was the first piece I put in place for the retirement system, I think the next will be the brew house with moisture recovery.
Thanks all!

Not to talk down RO water as for some people with their brewing water I get that starting with a clean slate water profile if perfect for them.

I was offered an RO system early this year off a local Aquarium guy who didn't need it
And I turned it down

My reason for me here in Palmwoods our water is pretty soft already and I didn't see any real benefits to adding this to my brew system

I get that if the source water is hard as F then yeah there's not much getting around that without cutting it with distilled or RO water to achieve a pilsner profile.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Not to talk down RO water as for some people with their brewing water I get that starting with a clean slate water profile if perfect for them.

I was offered an RO system early this year off a local Aquarium guy who didn't need it
And I turned it down

My reason for me here in Palmwoods our water is pretty soft already and I didn't see any real benefits to adding this to my brew system

I get that if the source water is hard as F then yeah there's not much getting around that without cutting it with distilled or RO water to achieve a pilsner profile.

Well, at home I'm using my well, and "well", it can be inconsistent. The base water is hard and the aquafer could also be affected by the nursey across the street. We also live next to a cemetery that had graves over 200 years old. I don't think they did too much that long ago to contain the sites. My well is about 150 feet deep, so highly unlikely that any leaching could occur, but why take a chance?
Maybe I'll come up with Brewery name for my retirement homebrew! Suggestions are welcome.
Cheers All!

 

[Donoroto]

Well, at home I'm using my well, and "well", it can be inconsistent. The base water is hard and the aquafer could also be affected by the nursey across the street. We also live next to a cemetery that had graves over 200 years old. I don't think they did too much that long ago to contain the sites. My well is about 150 feet deep, so highly unlikely that any leaching could occur, but why take a chance?
Maybe I'll come up with Brewery name for my retirement homebrew! Suggestions are welcome.
Cheers All!

Well, maybe the water is the same used at Rogue for their Dead Guy IPA??

https://www.rogue.com/shop/beer/core/dead-guy-ipa/

 

[GFHomebrew]

Well, at home I'm using my well, and "well", it can be inconsistent. The base water is hard and the aquafer could also be affected by the nursey across the street. We also live next to a cemetery that had graves over 200 years old. I don't think they did too much that long ago to contain the sites. My well is about 150 feet deep, so highly unlikely that any leaching could occur, but why take a chance?
Maybe I'll come up with Brewery name for my retirement homebrew! Suggestions are welcome.
Cheers All!

This makes total sense to remove all particulates out of the water than including the ions .

 

[rallenhall]

For a practical guide to using RO water with a wide variety of beer malts & styles take a look at "Modern Homebrew Recipes," by Gordon Strong. All recipes are based on RO water.

 

[MoBeers]

I installed an RO system for my retirement brewery because my well water is really hard (213 ppm of total alkalinity). I sent a sample of my well water to Ward Labs for analysis and decided that diluting with 60% RO and 40% well water would give me a good starting point for most beers. I made up a sample of 60/40 water and sent that to Ward Labs for analysis as well. Now I have pretty good information to put into my brewing software.

The quantity of RO water that you need will create some complications for your retirement brewery. For a 5 gallon batch, you need about 10 gallons of water for mash and sparge. If you are brewing 15 gallon batches, you need about 22 gallons. By blending with well water, I can reduce the amount of RO water I need. Most RO systems come with a really small finished water tank that can deliver 3 gallons or so. You will need to upgrade to a big finished water tank to make enough RO water to get the job done. RO systems also generally have really slow flow from the tank to the faucet, so it can take 30 minutes to fill a 10 gallon pot. Finally, you should consider using an "RO rated" faucet for your RO system. RO water will leach metals from brass and copper fittings.

Oh, and don't forget that you will need a water softener to feed the RO system. Trying to make RO water with hard well water will require frequent filter and membrane changes. I fill my mash tun and hot liquor tank with the required amount of RO water, then turn off the RO system and put the softener on bypass so I can add the appropriate amount of hard well water to get the proper blend.

Cheers!
Dan

 

[Jayjay1976]

What @HighVoltageMan! said: the pH is irrelevant, the RO water has almost zero buffering capacity. This means even a drop of, say, vinegar in a gallon will move the pH a lot. Compared to the pH effects of the malt, RO water can be ignored as far as pH goes.

Like distilled water, it does not taste great either. Needs minerals.

I came here to say the same. I use the water calculator here at BF, using RO as starting water means all zeros. Easy enough that even I can do it.