Pitching Dead Yeast

[Donoroto]

Brewing a Whitbread Ale Likeness, the Wyeast 1099 packet they had at the FLHBS had a packing date of 29 June 2020. The packet says 'best used within 6 months of packing', bought it anyway because it was the only one they had.

Smacked it and this is what it looked like after 2-1/2 hours... not at all swollen. Opened it and pitched it, was darker brown and smelled like white wine. Ugh. Still a bit early to tell, but it may be that the entire packet was dead.

I have some S04 I can pitch to save the batch for the most part, but if the packet was really and truly completely dead (Hopeful some yeasties survived so it becomes a major underpitch) will it add significant off-flavors to the finished beer?

In other words, should I just dump it now, or add the S04. (I will wait 2 full days for signs of any fermentation first).

As usual, the photo from my phone displays sideways. @Yooper does the forum automatically reorient photos to landscape?

 

[Megary]

I would imagine that different brewers will have had different experiences in this situation.

The only time I had a WY smack pack remain perfectly flat (4-1/2 hours after smacking, no swelling at all), I decided to pitch it anyway. I let it go 54 hours but unfortunately it was DOA. I salvaged that beer by pitching US-05 at 54 hours and it took off as is its nature. The beer came out fine, if unremarkable. I didn't notice any dead yeast flavor.

 

[Bubba Wade]

I agree. Give it a couple of days. Since you’re in a sanitized vessel, there should not be a problem if the yeast are dead. US-04 will work well.

 

[Donoroto]

Perfect, completely agrees with my thoughts. The little bits of infection possibility were small, so wait I shall, and then S04 to the rescue if needed.

 

[J A]

I think it's totally irresponsible for brew supply stores to sell yeast that's 9 months old. They know it's not viable. It looses around 20% of it's viable yeast cells per month. The only thing you can do with a pack of liquid that's more than 3 months old is to make a starter, even for an ale pitch. If it's 6 months old, you might be able to make a 2-stage starter and get a good pitch.

 

[Megary]

I think it's totally irresponsible for brew supply stores to sell yeast that's 9 months old. They know it's not viable. It looses around 20% of it's viable yeast cells per month. The only thing you can do with a pack of liquid that's more than 3 months old is to make a starter, even for an ale pitch. If it's 6 months old, you might be able to make a 2-stage starter and get a good pitch.

I definitely agree that no LHBS should take money for liquid yeast that is that far past its "Best Buy" date. But I have used WY smack packs that all yeast calculators told me contained zero viable cells left that blew up and fermented just fine.

 

[Donoroto]

I just consider it the price of my education, $7.99. I guess I can go back to them and whine about it, since I spent low four figures at their store last year, but instead I'll just keep it as a lesson learned. Next time I'll be more assertive.

 

[Craigerrr]

The best way to pitch dead yeast is into the bin!

 

[Mark Farrall]

If the yeast cells died badly they could rupture and spill out their salty/umami tasting contents. It doesn't sound like it from your description, so maybe they're just providing nutrient to the remaining yeast.

 

[Hawkbox]

I built a starter off a jar of yeast a year old in my fridge the other day and it worked fine. I'd let it sit and see if it comes back, as you said worst case you have S-04 to back you up.

 

[Donoroto]

The rest of the story: After 24 hours, there was nothing, not even a peep, from the WY 1099 yeast. I popped the cover and added a pack of rehydrated S04. After a 12 hour lag, the yeasties went nuts in what was essentially a 20 liter starter and brought it down to 1.008 (from 1.036) in about 36 hours. It's sitting at 1.008 for 3 days now, likely to cold crash it tonight and keg it Thursday... a 7-day brew.

A Whitbread likeness was the goal, the S04 shouldn't do it too badly though.

Would it be a kindness or an insult to bring my troubles with yeast to the attention of the FLHBS? I'm not looking for a refund, but perhaps a process change, so some other less-gracious customer doesn't suffer a similar fate? I know that if I were the owner I'd want to be told, but maybe I'm out of touch?

 

[Hawkbox]

If you know them reasonably well I'd just call or message them that it was NFG and they may want to have a huge disclaimer on them going forward.

 

[Donoroto]

I'll visit them - only 20 minutes away, and the "F" is for Friendly - and mention it next time I'm there. I need some gas tubing for a pressure-bottling contraption a friend loaned me, going to try it out filling my bottles for the NHC. Plan B is the 'old' way, a piece of tubing on the end of the picnic tap, which loses a little in foam, but no problem.

 

[GFHomebrew]

The best way to pitch dead yeast is into the bin!

Or into the boil and use em as nutrient for the next lot - lesson be learned yeasties or I'll boil your carcasses-!

@Donoroto I'd for sure bring it up in my next conversation with them (in a friendly way) nothing worse than getting people on the back foot if your trying to provide criticism.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

Or into the boil and use em as nutrient for the next lot - lesson be learned yeasties or I'll boil your carcasses-!

Yes! Old yeast should be added to the boil only. They're good for nutrients and that's about all. I got burnt a few years back and now I check the date of yeast prior to buying. Dry yeast isn't so bad, but liquid yeast can go bad from time or poor handling practices.