Infected Apricot sour?

jb1986

Member
Trial Member
Established Member
Joined
Apr 28, 2022
Messages
41
Reaction score
16
Points
8
Hello,

I brew an apricot philly sour 16 days ago. I added 3kg of frozen apricot in my 20l after 4 days and for 1 week.

Im wondering if it has been infected by brett in the apricots or something else. Its still bubling every ~5sec. Last time i oppened the fermenter I also saw white stuffs on top. Not sure if it was due to the apricots or maybe brett or ...?

What would you do ? I planned to cold crash now but maybe I should wait few more days? Weeks?

Thank you!
 
Hello,

I brew an apricot philly sour 16 days ago. I added 3kg of frozen apricot in my 20l after 4 days and for 1 week.

Im wondering if it has been infected by brett in the apricots or something else. Its still bubling every ~5sec. Last time i oppened the fermenter I also saw white stuffs on top. Not sure if it was due to the apricots or maybe brett or ...?

What would you do ? I planned to cold crash now but maybe I should wait few more days? Weeks?

Thank you!
Not experienced with such a beer, but in general: let it finish fermenting before cold crashing.

Is it finished? Bubbles are not a good indicator. The best indicator is 'no change in specific gravity for three days'.

Don't care what the gravity is, just that it does not change.

("White on top" can be many things, both normal and infected. After the cold crash, get a sample and smell & taste it. Infected is easily sensed, it will be foul. 'Just a bit off' is probably OK, give it time to carbonate and mellow then taste again).
 
Agree with above.

Pictures help with this too
 
White on top sounds like a pellicle - https://duckduckgo.com/?q=brewing+pellicle&t=braveed&iax=images&ia=images.

Freezing the fruit will kill off some of the microorganisms, but not all. So it's probably the fruit that has introduced something that's formed a pellicle. Pellicles aren't a bad or good thing, they're just a thing. It all depends on which microbe has formed the pellicle.

The constant bubbling is another sign that there's something like Brett. in there. It will be excreting enzymes to turn some of the complex sugar into more fermentable sugar.

At this point I'd just let it finish and taste it. If you've got over 3% ABV it's very unlikely to be harmful. Then pay careful attention to cleaning the fermenter and any equipment you use to package.

And for finished, as mentioned above, it's gravity, not bubbles. But in your case, you may just be better off getting a taste of what's in the fermenter and see if it's something you even want to package. I think there's a decent chance it'll be drinkable, if you like mixed fermentation beers. But there's also a decent chance you'll want to pour it down the drain.
 
Last edited:
But don't judge too soon!
If it is indeeda pellicle (picture please).

I had an issue with a batch recently. Bottled in pet bottles and very drinkable after 2 months.
Although a little strong as it fermented oit to 1.000 (and an ABV of 8.3 %)
I've given the empty bottles away as I couldn't be bothered cleaning them.
Fermenter obviously got cleaned, sanitised and all of that several times.

Maybe also post your full recipe and gravity readings if you have them
 
The comments related to cleaning are in response to Brettomyces' potential to ferment for very long times. Unless you understand and accept the related risks, it important to actually sterilize your equipment to eliminate all the Brett completely. Iodophor can do this, StarSan cannot. Let us know if you need more info.
 
... it important to actually sterilize your equipment to eliminate all the Brett completely. Iodophor can do this, StarSan cannot...

I think we've done this dance before haven't we? ;) StarSan is completely able to kill Brettanomyces. It's just that the manufacturer hasn't spent the money to prove that it does. Here's the 5Star response:

"StarSan was tested and approved for Ecoli and Staph which are both gram-positive bacteria aka larger bacteria. So short answer no we haven't officially tested for the kill rate on yeast bacteria and mold. However knowing that StarSan kills those two bacteria in an EPA good lab practice testing I would be confident in it's effectiveness."

And from Jess Caudill, microbiologist and brewer at Wyeast, asked whether Brett. was harder to kill than other microbes:

"No. It is as easy to kill as any Saccharomyces cerevisiae strain of yeast. No crazy chemical cocktails are necessary... just your normal alkaline cleaning and acid sanitization. It's up to you if you want different equipment for your wild brews."

But the debate about acid vs. iodine misses the far more important points about removing Brett. from the brewery. And that's how good is your cleaning and do you have small scratches in your equipment that you can't clean effectively?

If you've got a large enough colony of any microbe in a crack or crevice, it won't matter which sanitiser you use, you probably won't be soaking it long enough to kill those cells in the middle of the colony. And then if it's Brett or a diastatic Sacchromyces, they'll be able to propogate themselves up and affect the beer.

If it's a post packaging clean and your equipment can stand the temperatures, then a minute at 60C/140F is the current advice for pasteurisation of any microbes likely to be in a brewery, that isn't a spore. And if it's a spore (which is very unlikely to be in a home brewery) it's probably a Sacch. Cervesiae spore.

And again this approach really relies on having done a good clean before the hot water. And that good clean generally assumes some time with a caustic solution to break up/remove organic material.

Personally I soak with caustic for mixed fermentation batches. Then hot water rinse and store the equipment. I go to 70C if the equipment is rated for that, otherwise hot tap water. Sanitising is StarSan on the brew day and so far I haven't had any cleaning/sanitising related cross contamination in over 7 years of mixed fermentation brewing. And that's with about every third batch being a mixed fermentation batch.

I don't have separate equipment for the mixed ferment batches and the cold side is all plastic. I do note down the date when I purchased the fermenters and replace them after a few years. I should probably start doing the same with the tubing.
 
Ok, I'll buy into that.

Brett is as easy to kill as any yeast. But leaving one yeast of Brett could be a problem, Sacc. not so much.

I prefer Iodophor only because it sterilizes, not merely sanitizes. But if the StarSan folks admit it'll do just fine, surely they know their business.
 
Hello,

I opened the fermenter today to take a picture and the white pellicle disappeared.

It was very similar to that: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=brewing+pellicle&t=braveed&iax=images&ia=images&iai=http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g336/mexican_millhouse/Pellicle.jpg

The recipe is this one but with appricots.:

Gravity
upload_2023-2-16_13-56-48.png


It's my first philly sour beer so it's hard for me to say if it is how it should be but IMHO it tastes very good.

I'll wait few more days, bottle it and follow your advices regarding cleaning.
 
Last edited:
Hello,

I opened the fermenter today to take a picture and the white pellicle disappeared.

It was very similar to that: https://duckduckgo.com/?q=brewing+pellicle&t=braveed&iax=images&ia=images&iai=http://i1096.photobucket.com/albums/g336/mexican_millhouse/Pellicle.jpg

The recipe is this one but with appricots.:

Gravity
View attachment 24242

It's my first philly sour beer so it's hard for me to say if it is how it should be but IMHO it tastes very good.

I'll wait few more days, bottle it and follow your advices regarding cleaning.
Probably the best news you could have: Tastes Fine!
 

Back
Top