How much rest after whirlpool?

[timo944]

I'm a BIAB brewer. Can I get some advice on the process from the end of the boil to draining to the fermenter? The problem I have is that the outlet valve on my brew kettle sits a couple of inches off the floor, and I am leaving a lot of wort in the kettle leading to low efficiency (average 64%). Here is how it goes:

1. After the boil, chill for about 1/2 hour until 90F is reached. At this point I typically have 6.5 gal in the kettle
2. Remove chiller coil and whirlpool for about 5 mins using a stirring wand
3. Let sit for about 5 mins, then open the valve to drain wort into the fermenting bucket
4. Once the wort is drained into the fermenter I discover that I only have about 4 to 4.5 gal. The remaining wort is in the kettle still. I gently tip the kettle to drain the additional wort into the fermenter (to get to 5.5 gal). Sometimes I make it and some times not. The issue is that there are so many solids (proteins?) hat I don't want to introduce to the fermenter and I have to stop as they start to pile up. Even then, I am missing a gallon of wort (remember I have 6.5 after the boil).

To alleviate this I could simply increase my boil volume but I'm already at low efficiency and wish to improve that. So what am I doing wrong?

• Do I need to wait longer for the wort to rest before transferring so that the solids really settle to the bottom? I have not done this because I wish to get the wort in the fermenter and sealed as soon as possible to prevent contamination.
• Can I put some kind of screen on the valve to prevent the solids entering the fermenter?
• I'm usually adding a whirlfloc tablet at the end of the boil. Would adding another tablet help the solids to settle?
• Other thoughts?

TIA/Tim

 

[Minbari]

If you can add a drain tube to the inside of the boil kettle you can aim it for the bottom. I usually only have about 1/4" of liquid left this way.
And for the gunk in the bottom, try to leave most of it behind, but if it gets in the fermenor it is not the end of the world. It will drop out

 

[Sandy Feet]

I have efficiency issues with BIIB. It is what it is. Set your efficiency down in your software and add more grain.
I drain the kettle outside on a table. I have it drain into a funnel into the fermenter. I do have a screen that I can use that will fit on the funnel if I don't want the gunk.

 

[Sandy Feet]

And, you don't want to wait too long to drain. The quicker you drain and put the stopper on the fermenter, the less chance you have of infecting the beer.

 

[BarbarianBrewer]

Is it possible to safely raise your brew kettle high enough so you can drain the wort through a mesh strainer? You can also accomplish the same if you have a pump. I have a double-mesh strainer which catches most of the hop debris but not much of the break material. After that I usually just drain the whole kettle to my fermenter. I hate leaving any wort in the kettle and other than taking up space in the fermentor the solids don't do any harm. In fact yeast need some of the nutrients that are in the solids.

Are you sure your low efficiency is from leaving some wort in the kettle? If that is the cause you would see a drop between the Ending Kettle and the Brew House efficiencies. For the below I had left some wort in the kettle because my ending boil volume was too high and I could not get all the wort into the fermentor.

 

[Donoroto]

• Can I put some kind of screen on the valve to prevent the solids entering the fermenter?
• I'm usually adding a whirlfloc tablet at the end of the boil. Would adding another tablet help the solids to settle?

TIA/Tim

There is a good chance the screen will get clogged. This is not fun when it happens.
No, more whirlfloc won't help.

As mentioned above, getting a little of the trub (the gunk) in the fermenter is not a big problem. It will drop to the bottom over time, but be careful to not let it get into your bottles if you want clear beer.

 

[timo944]

If you can add a drain tube to the inside of the boil kettle you can aim it for the bottom. I usually only have about 1/4" of liquid left this way.
And for the gunk in the bottom, try to leave most of it behind, but if it gets in the fermenor it is not the end of the world. It will drop out

I hear you, however I read that some people are getting

 

[timo944]

Thanks for the advice. I found a hip filter online that basically a SS hose attached to a 1/2” fitting. They have a version with a 1/2 SS elbow that would allow me to snake the hose across the floor of the kettle. I think I’ll try that.

 

[Minbari]

Thanks for the advice. I found a hip filter online that basically a SS hose attached to a 1/2” fitting. They have a version with a 1/2 SS elbow that would allow me to snake the hose across the floor of the kettle. I think I’ll try that.

that is pretty much how mine is.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

The 1st question is why do you stop chilling at 90°? Are you only using Kveik ?
Next, why pull the chiller at all? It's fine to leave it in.
Before setting up a screened hose, why not add an elbow, turned down, to the inside of the kettle valve and maybe even a close nipple if you're still any distance off the bottom of the BK.
Then when cooling, gently whirlpool the entire time. When you approach your pitching temperature, stop whirlpooling and let it rest until the pitch temperature is reached.
Hook a hose to your kettle valve so while transferring to your Fermentor, you're below the bottom of the BK. This will maintain the siphon and suck it all the way down to the pick up you just installed.
Between hop debris, break material and wort, you should have less than 1/2 gallon left in the BK.
Less water, better efficiency, no tipping., No waste.
Try it out with water until you get it figured out.
Cheers
Brian

 

[The Brew Mentor]

With and without a false bottom

 

[timo944]

Brain -

OK, so the 90 is a typo. Truth is that I chill to 70 in the winter and ~80 in the summer. I brew outside with a propane burner, and here in GA it's almost impossible to get the wort down below 80 no matter how much ice I buy. i have a home made 1/2" copper cooling coil that works great but only to a certain point. So in winter I put the fermenter in the fermenting room and wait ~ 3-4 hours before pitching and in summer it's more like 6-12 hours.

Why pull the chiller? Because it's only about 10-12" diameter and it hard to get a good whirlpool. I suppose I could make it larger but I am afraid of kinking the copper. I do whirlpool while cooling - it's the fastest way to get the temp down (keep the wort moving over the copper). I feel like I get really good cold breaks.

I was thinking about getting one of these

... because it's $14 and comes with the 90 elbow and a 90 degree elbow alone is already $10 from Home Depot. My valve has 1/2NPT male thread inside the fermenter. I can choose to use the hose or not. I do use a (silicon) hose for the transfer to the fermenter so the suction will work well as you suggest.

Thanks for the good ideas. I have a good idea how to proceed!

Tim

 

[Minbari]

Brain -

OK, so the 90 is a typo. Truth is that I chill to 70 in the winter and ~80 in the summer. I brew outside with a propane burner, and here in GA it's almost impossible to get the wort down below 80 no matter how much ice I buy. i have a home made 1/2" copper cooling coil that works great but only to a certain point. So in winter I put the fermenter in the fermenting room and wait ~ 3-4 hours before pitching and in summer it's more like 6-12 hours.

Why pull the chiller? Because it's only about 10-12" diameter and it hard to get a good whirlpool. I suppose I could make it larger but I am afraid of kinking the copper. I do whirlpool while cooling - it's the fastest way to get the temp down (keep the wort moving over the copper). I feel like I get really good cold breaks.

I was thinking about getting one of these

... because it's $14 and comes with the 90 elbow and a 90 degree elbow alone is already $10 from Home Depot. My valve has 1/2NPT male thread inside the fermenter. I can choose to use the hose or not. I do use a (silicon) hose for the transfer to the fermenter so the suction will work well as you suggest.

Thanks for the good ideas. I have a good idea how to proceed!

Tim

Wouldn't get that keeping that braid clean will be a bitch.

For that money, buy a stainless elbow and barb on Amazon. The combination of the two should reach the bottom. If it doesn't, then a short piece of silicon tubing will work.

But honestly, i would just get the thing @The Brew Mentor showed

 

[The Brew Mentor]

https://www.menards.com/main/plumbi...1259320852.htm?tid=3709425153985648471&ipos=2
$3.55 at Menards

https://www.menards.com/main/plumbi...835/p-5239772153920835-c-6698461259320852.htm
$2.22

 

[naDinMN]

I'm a BIAB brewer. Can I get some advice on the process from the end of the boil to draining to the fermenter? The problem I have is that the outlet valve on my brew kettle sits a couple of inches off the floor, and I am leaving a lot of wort in the kettle leading to low efficiency (average 64%). Here is how it goes:

1. After the boil, chill for about 1/2 hour until 90F is reached. At this point I typically have 6.5 gal in the kettle
2. Remove chiller coil and whirlpool for about 5 mins using a stirring wand
3. Let sit for about 5 mins, then open the valve to drain wort into the fermenting bucket
4. Once the wort is drained into the fermenter I discover that I only have about 4 to 4.5 gal. The remaining wort is in the kettle still. I gently tip the kettle to drain the additional wort into the fermenter (to get to 5.5 gal). Sometimes I make it and some times not. The issue is that there are so many solids (proteins?) hat I don't want to introduce to the fermenter and I have to stop as they start to pile up. Even then, I am missing a gallon of wort (remember I have 6.5 after the boil).

To alleviate this I could simply increase my boil volume but I'm already at low efficiency and wish to improve that. So what am I doing wrong?

• Do I need to wait longer for the wort to rest before transferring so that the solids really settle to the bottom? I have not done this because I wish to get the wort in the fermenter and sealed as soon as possible to prevent contamination.
• Can I put some kind of screen on the valve to prevent the solids entering the fermenter?
• I'm usually adding a whirlfloc tablet at the end of the boil. Would adding another tablet help the solids to settle?
• Other thoughts?

TIA/Tim

1. 65% is about average for a BIAB mash. Add Rice hulls and you can push that to about 68%
2. I always cover my kettle and wait 30 minutes after a whirlpool to allow more proteins and hops to settle out. There is little risk of contamination if you sanitize your lid.
3. A Dip tube is sufficient for most brewers. You can get a false bottom, but I honestly don't think it is worth it for a BIAB situation.
4. No, one tablet of Whilfloc is sufficient. Just wait longer for more to settle.
5. Have you calculated your dead space? Open your ball valve and fill with water until it starts to flow out of the ball valve. pour the water into something that measure and then add that dead space into recipe/water calculations.