First all grain

Discussion in 'General Brewing Discussions' started by All mashed up, Feb 1, 2016.

  1. All mashed up

    All mashed up New Member

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    Hello all. Mike hear (brewing for 3 months) cooked up my first all grain on Saturday. Mash tun was at 77c to start with, stirred it a few times till it was 66 but took 30 mind. First sparge got stuck , sieved some grain out and worked it through. Carried out 60 min boil with hops and irish moss for the last 10 mind. Chilled in 20 mind, gravity 1.040 in fermenter. Pitched yeast at about 22. A couple of bubbles from air lock now no signs of life at all. Did the starting high temp in mash tun produce Un fermentable sugars? Or will it start later for some reason? All my other batches started inside 12 hours. If anybody has any ideas I would greatly appreciate them.
    Mike
     
  2. jeffpn

    jeffpn Well-Known Member

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    I was surprised to see my batch yesterday start bubbling in 6 hours. I could see growth in the yeast. This morning, there's even more yeast. That said, I've had batches take 36 hours before showing any signs of life. RDWHAHB.
     
  3. All mashed up

    All mashed up New Member

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    Hi thanks for your response jeffpn. Checked tonight, dead as a door mouse with strange burnt smell!
    Maybe all grain is harder than I thought. Ideas where I went wrong, anyone.
    Going to send it to the seaside on Thursday if no improvement.
    Cheers
     
  4. All mashed up

    All mashed up New Member

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    Managed to change my profile name. That's one thing I have been successful in! ;)
     
  5. ldh909

    ldh909 New Member

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    Sorry about the lack of responses. Maybe there are lots of people like me, not knowing exactly what to say. The high mash temperature does not help, but I don't think it would make your wort completely unfermentable.
    If you have it on hand, and you want to risk another $5 on the project, you might try pitching another batch of yeast in there. I've honestly never had a batch that did not ferment at all. I've been worried a few times, but I don't think I've ever had one go beyond 36 - 48 hours.
    Idea 1. Are you sure about the temperature of the wort when you added the yeast? This sounds more like yeast abuse than wort abuse, especially at a gravity that low.
    Idea 2. Taste some of the wort. Regardless of the burnt smell, it should taste at least mildly sweet.

    I only brew all-grains in small batches, so I don't have a mash tun. I mash in the boiler on an induction burner. Great temperature control.
     
  6. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    I don't know what's going on with your yeast but the high temperature in the mash tun would not lead to a stuck fermentation. I'm suspecting something else: Have you checked your gravity at all since fermentation started? Yeast, given sugars and oxygen, will inevitably ferment. The only thing that could would cause no fermentation would be pitching the yeast at too high a temperature - you mentioned 22 degrees C. That wouldn't do it., although fermentation temps that high could cause some off-flavors. I'm thinking there's a leak in your fermentation system somewhere that's letting gas out without it going through the airlock. Check the gravity. If it's dropping, your wort is fermenting.
     
  7. All mashed up

    All mashed up New Member

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    Thanks guys. I appreciate your comments.
    I may just do that and risk more yeast as it is my first all grain. :? :?
    It just looks like a pond of dark, never been discovered stagnant cave water with no signs of life (even bacteria seems to avoid it) when I checked on it tonight!
    Not trying to be a whiner, just interested to find out what has gone wrong (i can only get better at it from here).
    Laters
     
  8. jmcnamara

    jmcnamara Well-Known Member

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    Just a thought, but what if the yeast are already done?

    For arguments sake, let's say a wort with that gravity of 100% fermentable sugar would take 10 hours for that yeast to eat through. And let's say the expected FG is 1.005.
    I'm not sure how much unfermentable sugar is produced at which temperature, but the higher the temp the more unfermentable you get.
    By increasing the unfermentables while keeping the same OG would mean less food for the yeast, so they'd eat through it quicker. Less food, less time to ferment.
    I may be completely wrong, but hopefully I was able to get across what I was thinking
     
  9. ldh909

    ldh909 New Member

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    Just one more comment, and it's a work of advice. Especially with all-grain, taste your wort! :) Smell it, taste it all along the way. Taste when you first add hot water to your mash, taste it after 30 minutes of mashing, when you put it in the boiler, when you put it in primary, secondary, etc.
    As a previous comment said, take a hydrometer reading. Trust the science. But don't throw the wort back into the fermentor, smell and taste it. Trust your senses. If it's still sticky sweet, it has not fermented.
     
  10. All mashed up

    All mashed up New Member

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    It's great to hear all your ideas, have not been brewing very long but love this hobby. I checked gravity this morning and is still the same as before I pitched the yeast (1.040, i had hydrated yeast and proved). I have sprinkled 6g of yeast on top this morning (10L batch) so will be interesting to see if it starts! :? If it does I will take it something went wrong with the first yeast and will mean I will have some beer to try (lose then win) or if it doesn't start it must have been something wrong with the mashing I did and no beer to look forward to (lose then lose)!
    I shall keep you posted lads.
    All good fun :D
     
  11. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    Hmmm. Interesting that even bacteria are avoiding your wort! I'm thinking either you didn't oxygenate at all or you pitched too hot and killed the yeast. Generally if you give yeast some wort, they will start eating pretty quickly.
     
  12. All mashed up

    All mashed up New Member

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    Hi, An update. The second yeast did not start any fermentation. (it is now on its way to the seaside! :( ).
    I was in my local brew shop yesterday, I talked about it with the owner and he confirmed what I was beginning to think. The mash tun was to hot for two long, yes the starch would have been converted into sugar but unfermentable sugar due to the heat and the fact that it is a different enzyme which operates at the higher temp producing unfermentable sugar. Maybe maybe not!!!! :?
    Cheers every one
     

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