CaraMunich vs. CaraWheat for a Dunkelweizen

Discussion in 'General Brewing Discussions' started by OkanaganMike, Nov 17, 2016.

  1. OkanaganMike

    OkanaganMike Active Member

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    Title says it all. I'm researching Dunkelweizens for a local homebrew comp in January and can't find CaraWheat locally. Thinking about roasting my own (on another thread and didn't want to derail it with this question). Anybody have experience with Dunkels and if so, can I swap these 2 out?
    Below is my base recipe so far.

    Title: Dunkelweizen Schnitzelblitz

    Brew Method: BIAB
    Style Name: Dunkles Weissbier
    Boil Time: 60 min
    Batch Size: 5.5 gallons (fermentor volume)
    Boil Size: 7.5 gallons
    Boil Gravity: 1.037
    Efficiency: 75% (brew house)


    STATS:
    Original Gravity: 1.051
    Final Gravity: 1.012
    ABV (standard): 5.17%
    IBU (tinseth): 15.09
    SRM (morey): 20

    FERMENTABLES:
    4 lb - American - White Wheat (39.5%)
    2 lb - Canadian - Munich Dark (19.8%)
    2 lb - American - Pilsner (19.8%)
    2 oz - German - Carafa II (1.2%)
    2 lb - American - CaraCrystal Wheat Malt (19.8%)

    HOPS:
    1 oz - Domestic Hallertau, Type: Pellet, AA: 3.9, Use: Boil for 60 min, IBU: 15.09

    MASH GUIDELINES:
    1) Temp: 150 F, Time: 60 min

    YEAST:
    Wyeast - Weihenstephan Weizen 3068
    Starter: Yes
    Form: Liquid
    Attenuation (avg): 75%
    Flocculation: Low
    Optimum Temp: 64 - 75 F
    Fermentation Temp: 68 F
     
  2. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    I'd go with the Caramunich anyway. It seems closer to style.
     
  3. OkanaganMike

    OkanaganMike Active Member

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    Ya been having a hell of a time trying to figure out my recipe. Researched a ton and I need at least 50% wheat for a Dunkelweizen, some recipes are really simple and I'm prolly overthinking things. Think I'm going to go with this latest version roasting my own Carawheat.

    Brew Method: BIAB
    Style Name: Dunkles Weissbier
    Boil Time: 60 min
    Batch Size: 5.5 gallons (fermentor volume)
    Boil Size: 7.5 gallons
    Boil Gravity: 1.040
    Efficiency: 75% (brew house)


    STATS:
    Original Gravity: 1.055
    Final Gravity: 1.012
    ABV (standard): 5.53%
    IBU (tinseth): 14.74
    SRM (morey): 21.61

    FERMENTABLES:
    4 lb - American - White Wheat (37%)
    1.5 lb - American - CaraCrystal Wheat Malt (13.9%)
    3 lb - American - Pilsner (27.7%)
    2 lb - Canadian - Munich Dark (18.5%)
    4 oz - German - Carafa II (2.3%)
    1 oz - German - Melanoidin (0.6%)

    HOPS:
    1 oz - Domestic Hallertau, Type: Pellet, AA: 3.9, Use: Boil for 60 min, IBU: 14.74

    MASH GUIDELINES:
    1) Infusion, Temp: 150 F, Time: 60 min

    OTHER INGREDIENTS:
    1 each - Whirlfloc, Time: 15 min, Type: Fining, Use: Boil

    YEAST:
    Wyeast - Weihenstephan Weizen 3068
    Starter: Yes
    Form: Liquid
    Attenuation (avg): 75%
    Flocculation: Low
    Optimum Temp: 64 - 75 F
    Fermentation Temp: 66 F
     
  4. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

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    Might consider 90min. mash for 50/50 wheat or double check conversion with iodine test.
    Also 2row has more enzymes than pils and flavor or color between the 2 wouldn't matter for this darker beer.
     
  5. OkanaganMike

    OkanaganMike Active Member

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    Hadn't thought about the longer mash. Most of my research shows a 50/50 with wheat and either Pils or Munich. The Pilsner I'm using is Gambrinus and I'm pretty sure it's 2 row so enzymes should be about them same. I'll do a bit more readng to confirm your claim of the pils not having the same diastatic power as 2 row pale. You may be onto something there and an extra 30mins mashing woudn't hurt anyway.
     
  6. Ozarks Mountain Brew

    Staff Member

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    first conversion has nothing at all to do with high sugar content, the conversion can happen in a little as 15 minutes but pulling sugar off the grain can take a while and it's all up to the brewer how well they lauter, thats the key to pulling sugar off
     
  7. OkanaganMike

    OkanaganMike Active Member

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    I do BIAB and think I'll prolly just do a single infusion at 150-152F
     
  8. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

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    Ozark I respectfully disagree with your statement. Conversion of wheat is different than barley. Even with the fully modified malts we use. Wheat has always taken longer according to my iodine testing when using 50/50 mix. It needs some help to fully convert.
     
  9. OkanaganMike

    OkanaganMike Active Member

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    Got me some Amylase kicking around so maybe I'll throw a tsp in at mash time. That always helps conversion!
     
  10. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

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    Curiosity got the better of me( I forget so I have to re-research) so I did some research:confused: and wheat has more protein but more diastatic power than most 2 row barley. It may be other influences than DP that cause me to have to leave in the mash longer. I brew a lot of wheat beers and have tried lots of things to shorten up mash time but when used 50/50 it just seems to take longer to convert for me. I like using wheat for the # for # sugars I get from the grain but will keep looking into this.
     
  11. Ozarks Mountain Brew

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    I guess how you brew makes a huge difference, recirculation or not, but yes I was talking about barley so I guess your right on that note
     
  12. KC

    KC Active Member

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    Brew yet? Curious as to why you even need a caramel malt since you have Carafa for color. IBU is low so you don't need sweetness to offset. My Dunkel weiss uses midnight wheat for color but have used Carafa-II special for the same effect. I prefer red wheat to white but that's personal taste.
     
  13. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

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    Red wheat is un malted yes? Raw I used some in cream ale

    If so nothing would stop me using the soup packet wheat at shop eho_O.

    Sorry for thread twist I won't do it again:oops:
     
  14. jmcnamara

    jmcnamara Well-Known Member

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    Haha, how dare you TB turn this thread into anything less than respectable. We've got a reputation to uphold and all. What would your ma think? :(
     
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  15. KC

    KC Active Member

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  16. OkanaganMike

    OkanaganMike Active Member

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    Haven't brewed it yet. Prolly in 2 weeks time. Decided on the cara-wheat addition for flavor complexity. In researching Dunkelweizens I found one where the owner claimed to have won a comp using it so good enough for me. I've never done a dunkelweizen and figured I'm in a group with some serious talent and experience so if I could benchmark my recipe to a tried and true I may have a better chance. o_O
     
  17. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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  18. OkanaganMike

    OkanaganMike Active Member

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    That looks good too. Wish I had time to brew a couple of them first. Oh well, gotta try one.
     
  19. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

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    One step at a time Capin
     
  20. OkanaganMike

    OkanaganMike Active Member

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    Yup - either way I know I'm gonna like it so's thats the main thing
     

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