Boil Length Question

[Andrew_D]

Question from an all grain newbie (just 3 BIAB sessions so far): If the specified boil time is 60 minutes, but the first hops don't go in until, say, 30 minutes or later, what is the first 30 minutes of the boil achieving, apart from reducing the volume? Is it possible to simply boil for 30 minutes, with a lower pre-boil volume and putting the hops in at the start?

 

[Herm brews]

That reduction in water volume increases the original gravity (OG), which is where the alcohol (abv) comes from. Cutting your boil time in half will result in a higher volume of lower abv beer.
I too am a BIAB home brewer. As an example, a recent batch that I brewed had a lower than expected pre-boil gravity (6 points low), but a higher than expected pre-boil volume. To compensate, I lengthened the boil time from 60 to 70 minutes, adding my bittering hops addition at 10 minutes into the boil. In the end, my OG was just 2 points below projection, and volume into the fermenter was spot on. And the resulting beer is very nice - I’ll be enjoying a glass or two tonight.
I hope this helps.

 

[Bubba Wade]

In my opinion, that first 30 minutes only aids in reducing wort volume.

I set up all of my recipes for a 30 minute boil. That is sufficient for hot break and DMS removal for most malts. There is some data that shows certain pilsner malts need 60 minutes or more of vigorous boil to break it down. I use standard 2-row and Vienna malt and have no issues.

If your recipe has a 60 minute hop addition, you may need to adjust the amount slightly, about 20% or so to achieve the same IBU.

Another benefit of a shorter boil is a shorter brew day.

 

[Nosybear]

It's driving off DMS, denaturating proteins, making maillard products.... A lot is going on in the boil! As homebrewers outside on propane burners in the wind, we are over-boiling our worts, excessive heat loading, I believe it's called. As an electric brewer inside, I can lower the boil-off rate. Another thing: Here at 6,000' elevation my default boil time is 90 minutes to make sure I get all the DMS out - my boil temperature is only 202 degrees F. But I'm not in a hurry.

 

[Herm brews]

So different strokes for different folks.

 

[Donoroto]

As @Nosybear wrote, that first 30 minutes is more than simple water removal. But whether you want those other things or not is a matter of preference. Most (but not all) brewers want those other things to happen.

As with any recipe: Follow the recipe closely at first, but then feel free to experiment (with careful notes!) to see if this or that change makes things better or worse. Try to keep it to one change at a time so you can honestly judge the effects. While not impossible, it takes some decent effort to produce bad beer.

 

[Nosybear]

As @Nosybear wrote, that first 30 minutes is more than simple water removal. But whether you want those other things or not is a matter of preference. Most (but not all) brewers want those other things to happen.

As with any recipe: Follow the recipe closely at first, but then feel free to experiment (with careful notes!) to see if this or that change makes things better or worse. Try to keep it to one change at a time so you can honestly judge the effects. While not impossible, it takes some decent effort to produce bad beer.

...but great beer comes from attention to detail. And knowing WHY a given change could produce an effect you want. When I make a change and am evaluating it, I always take the position that whatever I did had no effect, then see if I can prove myself wrong.

We do the things we do because they work. Pros boil 60 minutes because it works, not because they want to spend the money on all that natural gas. To me, it takes a great amount of evidence to disprove something that's been standard for as long as a 60 minute boil. Some expert on the Internet is not going to make me change my process. But I read George Fix stating we put too much thermal load on our worts so lowering the boil-off rate seems to me to be a worthwhile experiment.

Also consider this: Anyone with a webcam can set themselves up as an expert. Right now there are likely a billion people posting to the Internet, most of which is cat videos and crap. And bottom line, you try it and a 30 minute boil works for you, use it.

I'm sticking to 90.

 

[Hawkbox]

I boil for 60 cause I'm to lazy to go change all my recipes out primarily. I've had precisely one instance where I can say with confidence I noticed DMS and it was with undermodified continental pilsner malt so I boiled that for 90 minutes. At no other time in the 100+ batches I've brewed have I noticed a meaningful difference based on boil length.

An enormous amount of what home brewers do is cargo cultism from commercial brewers that have different standards and requirements, don't be scared to try both ways and see what works for you. They're not keen on throwing away barrels of beer on an experiment while we have no such risks.

 

[Craigerrr]

Most brews I boil for 60 minutes.
For NEIPA's that either get no boil hops, or a minimal bittering hop, I have been boiling for 30.

 

[HighVoltageMan!]

There’s no one answer. You need to boil to a target specific gravity, not to a specific volume. Boil times vary mostly with the malt type.

DME or LME really only needs to boiled long enough to sanitize it and get the proper bitterness.

Certain varieties of malted barley require longer boils (90 minutes or more) due to the kiln temperatures and the barley itself is prone DMS which can come across as cooked corn or cauliflower. Longer boils reduce the risk of having this off flavor. This is usually only applied to European Pils malt, but American pilsner could also produce it.

All other malts require only an hour. You can shorten the boil, but if you an all grain brewer, you’ll need that time to drive off enough water to get the target gravity anyway.

I’m with Nosy on this, one short cut may work without a noticeable difference, but often these short cuts are combined and the beer quality suffers.

Its easy to make beer. It’s hard to make good beer. It’s really hard to make great beer and it’s damn near impossible to make a world class beer. I like world class beer the best, but its a lot of work.

 

[Nosybear]

There’s no one answer. You need to boil to a target specific gravity, not to a specific volume. Boil times vary mostly with the malt type.

DME or LME really only needs to boiled long enough to sanitize it and get the proper bitterness.

Certain varieties of malted barley require longer boils (90 minutes or more) due to the kiln temperatures and the barley itself is prone DMS which can come across as cooked corn or cauliflower. Longer boils reduce the risk of having this off flavor. This is usually only applied to European Pils malt, but American pilsner could also produce it.

All other malts require only an hour. You can shorten the boil, but if you an all grain brewer, you’ll need that time to drive off enough water to get the target gravity anyway.

I’m with Nosy on this, one short cut may work without a noticeable difference, but often these short cuts are combined and the beer quality suffers.

Its easy to make beer. It’s hard to make good beer. It’s really hard to make great beer and it’s damn near impossible to make a world class beer. I like world class beer the best, but its a lot of work.

I beg to differ: It's easy to make a world-class beer. Just pay attention to every niggling little detail and do all the steps exactly right. I'm still working on the latter...