Bad Santanator

Discussion in 'Recipes for Feedback' started by BilltownBrewingCo, May 8, 2019.

  1. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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    'tis the season, right?

    Haha, no... but I plan on lagering this dopplebock for a good long time, so I'll be brewing it in either late June or Early July to be ready in time for Christmas.

    I am going back and forth on a few things... first and foremost, weather or not to add some chocolate malt. I'm also internally debating over the finer subtleties of the different noble hop varieties (that likely don't matter without a later hop addition).

    Any thoughts on this recipe for a Christmas dopplebock?

    https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/811155/bad-santanator
     
  2. Mark Farrall

    Mark Farrall Well-Known Member

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    On the chocolate Ozarks convinced me to try about 5% in a saison recently. Worked well, gave a nice smooth barely roasted flavour.

    Do you want to push the Christmas angle? Maybe some subtle spices? Or special b for dried fruit (though I struggle to get that the times I've used it).
     
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  3. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

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    #3 Trialben, May 9, 2019
    Last edited: May 9, 2019
    I find when loading up crystal malts on Lager Yeast can sometimes result in an over the top sweetness sometimes but admit I know nothing much about brewing dark lagers. I find it a challenge on the darker side when it comes to lagers I'd try and achieve your colour with as little Crystal malt as possible or substitute some with that caraffa special roast malts from Weyermann. Maybe I'm thinking more Swartzbier than dopplebock though maybe I'll go read the BJCP on the style Lol.
    https://www.bjcp.org/2008styles/style05.php
    I admit your grist seems to match the descriptions intense malt flavour melanoidins from extended boil but i do see reference to slight chocolate notes acceptable and prune flavours so @Mark Farrall comments on Special B seem to be on the money. I recon it'd tick the boxes for a Christmas beverage in a cold Climate (not Australia).
     
  4. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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    I have had spices cross my mind, but I've not done a Dopplebock before, and would like to do the first one relatively true to style. Maybe in subsequent Christmases I will get froggy and throw some spices in.
     
  5. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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  6. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    That seems like an awful lot of melanoidin to me but I've never used more the a 4 oz so can't really speak from experience.

    I think a small amount of chocolate would be great. I really like using chocolate rye for something like this.
     
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  7. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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    I agree, seems like a lot. I had it significantly lower, then read in a few places that you can go up to 20% when trying to replace the flavors that would be created by doing a decoction mash... Do you (or anyone else on here) have any experience in using melenoidin in an attempt to skip a decoction?
     
  8. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    Yep. It doesn't work. But the good news is, Munich does. Melanoidin gives a very unpleasant flavor to me, reminiscent of ink, the kind that goes in old-fashioned Bic pens (not that I ever tasted the stuff, just, you know, the way it smells). In any amount in a light beer, I find it cloying. It might work in darker beers.
     
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  9. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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    So, With the base malt being Munich, you think i'm ok just removing it? I wouldn't mind doing that, adding some dark munich and potentially some chocolate.
     
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  10. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

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    Don't know how your going to keep attenuation at 1.020 ish though unless that lellamand Munich yeast is a 60% attenuator. Maybe a longer boil could help you get that natural malenoidon thing going or a single decoction rest:rolleyes:.
     
  11. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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  12. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    Go with the dark Munich, keeping in mind my aversion to Melanoidin is my aversion - you might like it! The longer boil suggested above might add a bit of flavor.
     
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  13. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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    I don't have any idea on Melanoidin, but I have really enjoyed Dark Munich in the past, so I'll gladly switch out for it.
     
  14. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    I personally like this iteration a lot more.
     
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  15. Mark Farrall

    Mark Farrall Well-Known Member

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    There's also the lazy decoction. Just take some of the wort after the mash and boil it in a separate pot for a while. It's been suggested by a few people here and it's something I've been thinking of doing, but I think I'm too lazy for the lazy decoction.
     
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  16. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

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    Looks a goer now billtown!
     
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  17. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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    Thanks all for your feedback. I do have one more question...

    The barke Munich is a lower lovibond Munich, but are any of y'all worried about the low diastic power of this grain bill? I wonder if I shouldn't add some pilsner to it.
     
  18. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

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    I dont think so the Munich should have enough enzymes to convert itself and the crystal malt in the grist is already converted also there is no adjuncts in there. I think as long as the diastic power is above 60 it's all good.
     
  19. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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    Here in lies my issue... The BF calculator is telling me the DP is 43. However, it also says the "minimum" is 30. I'm thinking I may break up my light barke munich with some barke pilsner.
     
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  20. BilltownBrewingCo

    BilltownBrewingCo Active Member

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