Imperial Stout - thoughts?

[Megary]

Bumper Stout | Imperial Stout BIAB Beer Recipe | Brewer's Friend (brewersfriend.com)

I've made many stouts and porters before, but never an Imperial, which I consider a whole different beast. I'm thinking "complex", but I'm worried about "muddled".

My reasons:
The Pale is the base of course and the DME is strictly for gravity points (and to compensate for the limitations of my kettle).
The Munich is to provide a little rich maltiness, but I've also gotten nuts, chocolate and toast from this malt before.
The Twilight Wheat is for foam retention primarily, but this malt has a definite almond presence.

Flaked Barley - because it's a Stout and it belongs, and you can never have enough foamy goodness.

C120 - hoping to balance the dark malts with a bit of stone fruit, caramel
Pale Chocolate - the only "chocolate" malt that I've ever detected chocolate from.
Roasted Barley - a touch or roast is required.

Magnum is an easy choice for bittering.
The Northern Brewer/Willamette hops feel appropriate and I have them in stock, but I'm not sure I have the timing and amounts correct.

BRY-97 is a great yeast, attenuates well (too well?) and can handle the ABV. But I'm open to suggestions here. WY1084/WLP004? Notty?

I also will add either vanilla beans to the fermenter or vanilla extract at bottling time.


Love to hear thoughts on any or all of this. Will be brewing this right after the holidays.

 

[Sunfire96]

It sounds really good! Will be following.

My first thought is the C120 would add too much complexity, and perhaps result in the "muddled"-ness you're trying to avoid? I associate those plum/raisin/stone fruit flavors more with a Baltic Porter, where the chocolate/coffee and roast flavors are not very pronounced.

I think if your goal is coffee, chocolate, vanilla, roast, and smoothness in a big@ss beer, then you've got that without the caramel. But I've never brewed one of these and only drank a couple, so take my advice with plenty of salt!! Cheers

 

[jmcnamara]

Fwiw I think using Northern brewer is a good choice. I think Mosher said they can be used (along with a few other ingredients) to mimic a chocolate flavor. It was in Radical Brewing

 

[Megary]

It sounds really good! Will be following.

My first thought is the C120 would add too much complexity, and perhaps result in the "muddled"-ness you're trying to avoid? I associate those plum/raisin/stone fruit flavors more with a Baltic Porter, where the chocolate/coffee and roast flavors are not very pronounced.

I think if your goal is coffee, chocolate, vanilla, roast, and smoothness in a big@ss beer, then you've got that without the caramel. But I've never brewed one of these and only drank a couple, so take my advice with plenty of salt!! Cheers

Thanks for the reply. I definitely see your point. Duly noted.

I'm not necessarily aiming for a BJCP style here, just something that will bounce around the palate, warm the gizzard and hopefully age well. I know that I don't want this to be like my house Stout, which is essentially dry and roasty (and imo, very crushable). With this Imperial, I'm looking for that "big beer depth" that you are alluding to. And when compared to the house Stout, the Chocolate and Munich are already adding more complexity. The hope is that the Crystal will add a bit of sweetness and sort of round the whole thing out, but that's just me dreaming. I really have no idea what it will do.

 

[Megary]

Fwiw I think using Northern brewer is a good choice. I think Mosher said they can be used (along with a few other ingredients) to mimic a chocolate flavor. It was in Radical Brewing

Good to know. I'll be leaving them in for sure.

 

[GFHomebrew]

Can't help you man except I'd go with anything but Nottingham in the yeast it's too clean for me.
I've got chocolate I'm sure from caraffa 2.

 

[Megary]

Can't help you man except I'd go with anything but Nottingham in the yeast it's too clean for me.
I've got chocolate I'm sure from caraffa 2.

I hear you on Notty. I rarely use it. The only reason I mentioned it is because I have heard it’s pretty reliable at very high ABVs.

 

[Minbari]

Only thing I would add is flaked oats. I like how it adds a nice silky mouth feel to stouts.

 

[Ward Chillington]

You could probably get a small beer out of that if you sparged the bag after it drains!

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Have you considered changing out the base malt and Munich for Maris Otter?
I think you'll get plenty of malt character along with rich caramel tones from it.
I also love London ale yeast for something like this.
My 2¢

 

[Megary]

Only thing I would add is flaked oats. I like how it adds a nice silky mouth feel to stouts.

I’ve had a lot of nice commercial beers that include oats and I know a lot of brewers have great success with oats. Unfortunately, I’m not one of them. Whenever I use them, I notice a great reduction in head formation and retention, and that “silky smooth” mouthfeel you describe comes across as an oil slick in my beers. I’ve used “quick oats” right out of the bag and into the mash and I’ve also toasted them first and then added them to the mash. Didn’t seem to make a difference. So this is on me, I’m obviously doing something wrong with the oats. I feel like if I add oats, they would counter the benefits that I get from the Flaked Barley and Wheat.

 

[Megary]

Have you considered changing out the base malt and Munich for Maris Otter?
I think you'll get plenty of malt character along with rich caramel tones from it.
I also love London ale yeast for something like this.
My 2¢

I have considered Maris Otter, and Golden Promise. It’s a great suggestion. I probably wrote the recipe this way because I always have that Pale and Munich in my house and have had great success with them. But…point taken. Thankfully I still have time to reconsider.
I love London yeast. I just used it in my Dark Mild and that beer came out fantastic. My concern is the attenuation. Like Windsor, I find London to be a poor attenuator (65%ish) and I’m concerned it will leave too much body, probably finishing in the upper 30’s, and the ABV would come way down. The ABV isn’t the end of the world, but drinkability is. Thoughts?

 

[The Brew Mentor]

I have considered Maris Otter, and Golden Promise. It’s a great suggestion. I probably wrote the recipe this way because I always have that Pale and Munich in my house and have had great success with them. But…point taken. Thankfully I still have time to reconsider.
I love London yeast. I just used it in my Dark Mild and that beer came out fantastic. My concern is the attenuation. Like Windsor, I find London to be a poor attenuator (65%ish) and I’m concerned it will leave too much body, probably finishing in the upper 30’s, and the ABV would come way down. The ABV isn’t the end of the world, but drinkability is. Thoughts?

I've been using the Apex London and getting ~75% attenuation.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Plus, on a big beer like this, I'd be upping the % of the dark malts.
The residual sweetness will balance the extra roast.
Thick, coal black, roasty, chewy persistent head with a big malt backbone and some residual sweetness, but not cloying.
Yummy!

 

[Megary]

I've been using the Apex London and getting ~75% attenuation.

Ok, I had the wrong "London" yeast! I can't find a technical data sheet on this yeast anywhere, but I do see on some sites that Apex London is only tolerant up to 9.5% ABV. Does that concern you?

 

[The Brew Mentor]

Ok, I had the wrong "London" yeast! I can't find a technical data sheet on this yeast anywhere, but I do see on some sites that Apex London is only tolerant up to 9.5% ABV. Does that concern you?

yes and no....
I've had the WLP013 London go over 12% in a Barley Wine, so no, but I haven't used the APEX for anything over 8%, so yes.
You could always blend, or add higher attenuating yeast during fermentation if it shows signs of slowing down.


file:///C:/Users/Store%20PC/Downloads/LondonAle_SpecSheet%20(1).pdf

 

[Megary]

yes and no....
I've had the WLP013 London go over 12% in a Barley Wine, so no, but I haven't used the APEX for anything over 8%, so yes.
You could always blend, or add higher attenuating yeast during fermentation if it shows signs of slowing down.


file:///C:/Users/Store%20PC/Downloads/LondonAle_SpecSheet%20(1).pdf

Unfortunately, I cannot open that file.

You've given me a lot to think about. I get the feeling that choosing the right yeast and properly fermenting this beer is going to be the key to success. I feel safe with BRY-97, but I also get the feeling that there may be better options. Looking at Wyeast's website, a few that might fit the bill are:
1028 - London Ale (11% Tolerance, 73-77%AA) - Maybe similar, if not the same as Apex London Ale or WLP013
1728 - Scottish Ale (12%, 69-73%)
1762 - Belgian Abbey (12%, 73-77%)

One other point I should make, if it matters: I will NOT be making a starter for this beer. This will be a direct pitch into the fermenter, probably two pouches into ≈3 gallons. If using liquid, I'll shake the bejeezus out of the fermenter, if using dry I'll just give the fermenter a swirl to mix. I'll likely pitch in the low to mid 60's depending on strain and will keep the beer in the mid-upper 60's for peak fermentation. I could raise the temp after fermentation starts to settle, if need be, or not.

 

[Minbari]

I’ve had a lot of nice commercial beers that include oats and I know a lot of brewers have great success with oats. Unfortunately, I’m not one of them. Whenever I use them, I notice a great reduction in head formation and retention, and that “silky smooth” mouthfeel you describe comes across as an oil slick in my beers. I’ve used “quick oats” right out of the bag and into the mash and I’ve also toasted them first and then added them to the mash. Didn’t seem to make a difference. So this is on me, I’m obviously doing something wrong with the oats. I feel like if I add oats, they would counter the benefits that I get from the Flaked Barley and Wheat.

Weird. Never had that issue. I do use flaked barely and\or white wheat to get the head back.

 

[The Brew Mentor]

 

[miaamelia]

Bumper Stout | Imperial Stout BIAB Beer Recipe | Brewer's Friend (brewersfriend.com)

I've made many stouts and porters before, but never an Imperial, which I consider a whole different beast. I'm thinking "complex", but I'm worried about "muddled".

My reasons:
The Pale is the base of course and the DME is strictly for gravity points (and to compensate for the limitations of my kettle).
The Munich is to provide a little rich maltiness, but I've also gotten nuts, chocolate and toast from this malt before.
The Twilight Wheat is for foam retention primarily, but this malt has a definite almond presence.

Flaked Barley - because it's a Stout and it belongs, and you can never have enough foamy goodness.

C120 - hoping to balance the dark malts with a bit of stone fruit, caramel
Pale Chocolate - the only "chocolate" malt that I've ever detected chocolate from.
Roasted Barley - a touch or roast is required.

Magnum is an easy choice for bittering.
The Northern Brewer/Willamette hops feel appropriate and I have them in stock, but I'm not sure I have the timing and amounts correct.

BRY-97 is a great yeast, attenuates well (too well?) and can handle the ABV. But I'm open to suggestions here. WY1084/WLP004? Notty?

I also will add either vanilla beans to the fermenter or vanilla extract at bottling time.


Love to hear thoughts on any or all of this industrial flooring toronto. Will be brewing this right after the holidays.

I just brewed this on Monday (6/18) & got an OG of 1.072. It's got crazy, crazy activity going right now in my 6.5 Gallon carboy. It plugged up my airlock with foam & beer so I had to install a blow off tube. I will report back with a reading when I go to Secondary. This is my first dark beer, anything I should be aware of?

* (2) 3.3 lbs Cans Munton & Fissons Old Ale Kit
* 3.3 lbs Can Munton's Light Plain Malt Extract Syrup
* 1/2 lb Roasted Barley
* 1/2 lb Black Patent Malt
* 3 tsp gypsum
* 2 oz Nugget Hop Pellets
* 1 oz Cascade hops leaves
* 1 cup dry light malt extract for priming
* (2) pkgs Irish Ale Yeast
* (2) pkgs dry yeast from Ale Kits (added during boil for more yeast food)
* 1/2 tsp Irish Moss
* 2 Tbs yeast nutrient