West Coast IPA

Discussion in 'Recipes for Feedback' started by goschman, Apr 11, 2019.

  1. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    I'm resetting and trying to come up with a new house IPA that is pretty much west coast inspired. After much experimenting with hybrid and NE influenced IPAs I have decided to get back to something more basic that aligns with my tastes.

    https://www.brewersfriend.com/homebrew/recipe/view/746907/iliff-ipa

    So this is what I'm planning for my first attempt and will obviously adapt it as time goes on. Any thoughts?

    Here are some of my goals:
    *simplicity and efficiency is the goal in regards to hops: no whirlpools, bio-transformation, DDH, etc.
    *set a baseline of 60 IBUs, adjust if necessary in subsequent batches
    *want a decent malt back hence the munich and honey malt. Say goodbye to oats and wheat
    *want dryness hence the sugar to encourage higher attenuation (I understand why some might advise against this)
    *big fan of citrusy hops and like what this hop combo brings to the table. Easily subject to change with Citra being a strong candidate to replace ekuanot or comet in the future.
    *after experimenting with bigger hop additions, I wasn't noticing more hop character. With my process, not sure using any more the 6 oz dry is worth it.
    *simple American ale yeast

    Any thoughts? Sorry, sometimes I do this to help myself think it through...
     
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  2. Craigerrr

    Craigerrr Well-Known Member

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    I am not qualified to comment on the recipe, bit I am interested to hear what others have to say. Also interested in following along to see how this turns out.
     
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  3. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

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    If you want hop flavor, definitely use more hops late in the boil and less at 60. Additions at 15 minutes can really do a lot to supply the desired IBUs and lend a lot of flavor and aroma.
    You're laboring under the misconception that adding plain sugar is going to magically increase your attenuation. You could mash in such a way as to get lousy attenuation even with a substantial amount of table sugar. You get excellent attenuation and dry, crisp malty beer by dialing in your mashing temp, PH, etc to produce a better quality wort and by oxygenating your wort and pitching a high enough cell count to ensure quick and efficient metabolism in the yeast. Save the sugar for when you want higher gravity.
     
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  4. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

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    #4 Head First, Apr 12, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2019
    I understand what you mean by just thinking it through.
    My take:
    Sugar more or less at that % won't affect it much. Stone uses sugar in their IPAs, just sayin. Probably saves them a few bucks for abv in large batches.
    Lose the honey malt. You will get enough sweet malt character from the Munich.
    I personally prefer victory or biscuit malt to give it the "beer" or (never liked the description of) bread dough flavor.
    Mash at 149f for a clean malt base to enhance the hop flavor.
    Hops are a personal preference thing to me. Whether you want bitter citrus or fruity citrus or balanced when additions go in and what they lean towards can vary greatly according to your taste. I prefer a grapefruit aroma with a good hop bite of citrus piney flavor that holds til the next drink but fades soon enough that your dinner doesn't taste like hops. You should be in this ballpark with this brew.
    Hope this helps, Cheers!
    Edit: Use 2 packs of 05 or do a starter for best attenuation from the yeast. WL Cal 01 helps hops too.
     
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  5. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    #5 Iliff Avenue Brewhouse, Apr 12, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2019
    Thanks! As noted, I was expecting the sugar comment. I have been considering an earlier hop addition prior to the 2 minute so maybe I will go with a 15 minute.

    I'm the lazy 45 minute mash and boil guy but luckily haven't noticed any attenuation issues up to this point. If I am doing certain beer styles I will will adjust my mash schedule.
     
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  6. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    #6 Iliff Avenue Brewhouse, Apr 12, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2019
    Thanks for the feedback! Unfortunately, the malt bill is locked in because I got grain before anyone responded. It may seem strange but I settled on Weyermann Pilsner and Munich to streamline my ingredients. I use Pilsner as my base malt for almost everything as I do a lot of lagers and session beers. A lot of my stuff is German/American hybrids
     
  7. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    #7 Iliff Avenue Brewhouse, Apr 12, 2019
    Last edited: Apr 12, 2019
    I moved one ounce of Ekuanot from 2 minutes to 15 minutes. This cut back my bittering hop amount considerably.

    Any input on water?
    Arbitrarily planning a mash pH of 5.40
    Ca - 90
    Mg - 5
    Na - 15
    SO4 - 165
    Cl - 55
    I seem to prefer SO4/Cl of 3
     
  8. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

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    I am a fan of 5 to 15 min. hop additions, seems to make all properties of the hop show yet leave more lingering bitter.
    The Pils/Munich sounds right for your tastes. As I said I prefer the beer flavor more than the german malty munich brings. Might try victory in next batch, it works well with citrus hop beers.
    As @J A pointed out clean complete conversion is the most important part to start with. Mash at 148 to 149 til it is complete, use an iodine test if you can.
    Water is similar to what I use for Ipa's also. I have a lot of temporary hardness so I start with more calcium and boil the water before cooling to mash.
    And don't get it right the first time! You will want to do lots of batches and experiments:rolleyes:;):D.
     
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  9. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    Thanks! Yeah I plan on diving deep into this one until I get it right.
     
  10. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

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    Nothing wrong with good Pilsner malt. It's not fundamentally different from most 2-rows, just a little drier and grainier in flavor. Though I often mix Pils and my local 2-row which definitely has more of a Pale Ale malt character, I don't think there's enough difference in most beer styles to quibble over which is best. Heck, I've got a Czech 2-row right now that'll make a perfectly convincing Helles Lager.
     
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  11. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    I got to brewing this yesterday. I had a good brew session and overshot my OG by 1 point so am happy with that. Woke up to good fermentation activity this morning. I will be dry hopping in the keg so I should be able to get this out of the fermenter relatively quickly.

    Thanks for all the suggestions. I will probably be leaning on you guys for more suggestions on subsequent batches.
     
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  12. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    Dropped chest freezer to 30f last night. Gravity was at 1.014 but I’m expecting to gain a point or two as there was much yeast still in suspension. Kegging in a couple of says at which time I will add the dry hops.
     
  13. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

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    I doubt you'll get any drop once you drop temp. Doesn't matter how much yeast is there if it goes dormant and drops out. Some lager yeasts will work a little at fridge temps in the low 40's but even those stop at 30 degrees.
    At only 7 days from brew day, I'd have let it run a little longer to see if it would get the attenuation better. I'm sure it'll be fine, though. A few points on a kegged beer won't hurt anything.
     
  14. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    I’ve noticed a point drop between hazy and clear samples multiple times in the past. I confirmed the FG over a couple of days. US05 finishes very fast for me at 70f. I likely just need to adjust my mash profile.
     
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  15. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

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    Makes sense. I find US-05 to be a little uneven with attenuation. I've had it go well over 80% and at other times get stubborn and hang in the mid-70's, even with a fairly consistent mash.
    FG of 1.014 for a hoppy West Coast style beer isn't necessarily a bad thing. :)
     
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  16. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    You were right JA. A gravity reading at kegging was at 1.014. I have noticed a point or two drop when really hazy samples clear up a bit. Maybe I'm crazy.

    Added 2 oz each of Simcoe, Comet, and Ekuanot directly to the keg in a muslin sack and set at 30 PSI in the fridge. Sample tasted great with a hop/malt balance that I was looking for. Should be best to drink in a couple of weeks while hop character is at it's peak.
     
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  17. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    #17 Iliff Avenue Brewhouse, May 8, 2019
    Last edited: May 8, 2019
    Update. This beer has turned out really good and is a good baseline from which to start. I have already made some adjustments to the recipe which I think will improve it.

    Took about 10 days to become drinkable with the hops in the keg. The malt character is a lot cleaner and lighter than I was expecting. Sometimes as the beer warms I get a hint of underlying bready munich character. No need to change the grist yet. The hop profile is nice but moderate and little let intense than expected. The aroma is super pleasant mainly with notes of candied citrus, stone fruit, and perhaps a bit of melon. Surprised with the lack of pine and dankness. At 6% abv the beer is super drinkable and almost drinks like an APA.

    Upcoming changes for next batch:
    *not bitter enough - increase warrior bittering addition and consider changes to water
    *not dry enough - adjust mash profile in hopes of dropping FG a couple of points
    *bump up ABV - see above
    *swap comet dry hop addition with citra
    *consider switching yeast to Notty (which I have little experience with)
     
  18. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

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    I could see those helping...If you want more pine, consider exchanging the Eukanot with Chinook. Also Simcoe at around 20 gives a nice bit of pine. Overall bitterness can be dialled in by changing your Whirlpool utilization rate. I find that calculating with the default of 10% doesn't seem to match with the percieved bitterness. I use 4% and get what I think is nearer the target. Perceived bitterness is subjective, though and with a beer that's pretty malty the bitterness can be balanced out quite a bit so you need more IBUs the less attenuated the beer is.
     
  19. Iliff Avenue Brewhouse

    Iliff Avenue Brewhouse Well-Known Member

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    Thanks for the response.

    *Not necessarily looking for pine just surprised there wasn't any although I guess it makes sense. I am considering altering the kettle hops though...
    *Did not conduct a whirlpool so that is a non factor for bitterness.
    *I need to remind myself not to change too much from batch to batch or make changes more subtle
     
  20. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    I was going to mention that.... A few of your changes conflict with each other, for example, more hoppy and more ABV (if added as more malt and not adjuncts) cancel each other in terms of sensory perception. Consider fewer changes at a time, for example, more sulfate will make your beer seem drier and more hoppy. Just a suggestion....
     

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