This recipe came out too sweet

Discussion in 'Recipes for Feedback' started by NTexBrewer, Mar 6, 2014.

  1. NTexBrewer

    NTexBrewer Member

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    Local Buzz is a beer that I tried to clone that is brewed by Four Corners Brewery in Dallas. I basically used the information from Four Corners' website to get the OG, IBU, and ABV. Used this info to calculate the FG. They describe it as a Honey - Rye Golden Ale. That is all the information they had so I just looked at other rye ale, amber ale recipes to figure out something to try. The beer did not really have any hop presence so I just decided to use cluster since I had some to use.

    The recipe that I came up with is listed below. The beer tastes good but it tastes too sweet. Especially for finishing low with the honey addition. So I'm looking for suggestions to reduce the sweetness with the next batch. I usually don't like to change too much at once. I know that I want to add a little more rye.

    Does the amount of Crystal affect the sweetness?

    Should I increase my bittering hops to balance the sweetness?

    Thanks!

    I should note that I actually numbers for the brew were:
    OG 1.048
    FG 1.010
    4.99%
    79.2% Attenuation
    67% Brewhouse efficiency

    HOME BREW RECIPE:
    Title: Local Buzz

    Brew Method: BIAB
    Style Name: American Amber Ale
    Boil Time: 60 min
    Batch Size: 1.5 gallons (fermentor volume)
    Boil Size: 2.3 gallons
    Boil Gravity: 1.029
    Efficiency: 75% (brew house)

    STATS:
    Original Gravity: 1.053
    Final Gravity: 1.011
    ABV (standard): 5.55%
    IBU (tinseth): 21.37
    SRM (morey): 11

    FERMENTABLES:
    1.75 lb - American - Pale 2-Row (64.1%)
    0.3 lb - American - Rye (11%)
    0.3 lb - Honey - (late addition) (11%)
    0.19 lb - American - Caramel / Crystal 80L (7%)
    0.19 lb - American - Caramel / Crystal 40L (7%)

    HOPS:
    0.15 oz - Cluster, Type: Pellet, AA: 6.5, Use: Boil for 60 min, IBU: 14.92
    0.1 oz - Cluster, Type: Pellet, AA: 6.5, Use: Boil for 20 min, IBU: 6.02
    0.1 oz - Cluster, Type: Pellet, AA: 6.5, Use: Boil for 1 min, IBU: 0.43

    MASH GUIDELINES:
    1) Temperature, Temp: 151 F, Time: 60 min, Amount: 2.3 gal
    2) Temperature, Temp: 170 F, Time: 10 min, Amount: 2.3 gal, Mashout at 170 for 10

    OTHER INGREDIENTS:
    1 tsp - Irish Moss, Time: 15 min, Type: Fining, Use: Boil

    YEAST:
    Fermentis / Safale - American Ale Yeast US-05
    Starter: No
    Form: Dry
    Attenuation (custom): 80%
    Flocculation: Medium
    Optimum Temp: 59 - 75 F
    Fermentation Temp: 70 F

    TARGET WATER PROFILE:
    Profile Name:
    Ca2: 0
    Mg2: 0
    Na: 0
    Cl: 0
    SO4: 0
    HCO3: 0
    Water Notes:
    Add Gypsum to Mash water

    Generated by Brewer's Friend - http://www.brewersfriend.com/
    Date: 2014-03-06 02:34 UTC
    Recipe Last Updated: 2014-02-01 04:53 UTC
     
  2. Ozarks Mountain Brew

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    I scaled it up to 5.5 gallons and 3 things, bitterness was low 19.62 or honey didn't all ferment for whatever reason and cluster has a different flavor than most hops, some people say sweet some say sour but its not your typical fruity hop flavor and has more lemony taste so could be a combination, if you kegged it good news it will get better, if bottled keep it cold wait 15 days and it will too but I would kick up the ibu to at least 25 or 30

    and no the crystal didn't add any sweetness to this beer
     
  3. NTexBrewer

    NTexBrewer Member

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    Thanks for the reply.

    I bottled. I'm planning to let it sit a little longer just to make sure it has fully carbonated. I will also do the longer chilling.

    Should I stay with Cluster or switch to a different hops?
     
  4. Ozarks Mountain Brew

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    if your trying to delicate that beer the srm should be lower some where in the 6 or 7 range, I'm sure something a little mellower hop was like saaz was used but not sure, its a little unknown unless you ask the head brewer
     
  5. 7 Slot Brewing

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    Is it possible the higher mash temp is contributing to the sweetness also?
     
  6. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    Is the sweetness lingering or does it go away quickly? The first is sugar, indicating the beer didn't finish fermenting or you have some unfermentable sugars in there. The latter is either malt or esters. I've had beers that came out too sweet and then, through the magic of bottle conditioning, cleaned up - the yeast reduced the esters, giving me a much dryer beer later on. Esters taste fruity, malt tastes like, well, oatmeal or cream of wheat. If it's the latter, more hops. If it's the former, time.
     
  7. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

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    And I think you hit on another possibility. If you naturally carbonated, the yeast may not have eaten all the priming sugar. Back to my first post, is the sweetness passing or lingering (does your mouth feel like you've had a drink of sweet Coke)? If it's the latter, it's likely priming sugar.
    Unless you're force-carbonating in a keg, of course.
     
  8. NTexBrewer

    NTexBrewer Member

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    Since this was a small batch, I'm going to let it sit for a while longer before I taste another. If it is carbing slowly I don't want to find out that it finally is ready to drink and not have many left :) I'll be sure to repost when I do.

    I think I will try to get to their Brewery Tour. That way I can ask directly about hops and other ingredients.
     
  9. NTexBrewer

    NTexBrewer Member

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    Figured I would post an update.

    I think part of the sweetness came from not being fully carbonated. It is fully carbonated and it is ok but still a little sweet.

    I think the next time I brew this, I will use a different hop and maybe increase the IBU's. Probably just do a bittering and flavoring addition.

    One other thing that may have contributed. I can't remember if I used some old hops. I have old hops in ziplock bags and in the freezer. I did not do any compensation for alpha acid loss from aging.

    Four Corners just started canning so I will wait until after they start distribution so I can have a taste and color comparison.

    I appreciate the feedback.
     
  10. Ozarks Mountain Brew

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    old hops will not be as flavorful but will retain bitterness more so than flavor, I prefer to keep my hops dry and at 65ish temperature. the reason is thawing and unthawing changes the moisture levels in the hop back and fourth and easier to mold after thawed out and not used, also the weight is off
     
  11. Alexv

    Alexv New Member

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    You can increase the hops a bit so it won't come out too sweet the next time. Or you just can reduce the honey, I am not big fan of it.
     
  12. NTexBrewer

    NTexBrewer Member

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    Finally had a chance to do a side by side comparison. My first attempt is definitely darker. I also don't have the rye bite like the original. Still it has turned out to be a nice beer.

    I'm not sure when I will brew the next iteration but here is the recipe I will try out. I'm brewing a Hommel Ale Clone attempt next week and then I need to work on my Christmas Beer which will be a Chimay Red Clone. Then I should be able to give this beer another try.


    I've eliminated the Crystal 80 and upped the Rye.

    I also went with a single bittering addition of Saaz.

    5 Gallon
    6.33 lb 2-Row 67%
    1.5 lb Rye 16%
    1 lb Honey 10%
    0.63 lb Crystal 40 7%

    1.5 oz Saaz (3.5% AA) 60 Min.

    US-05 Yeast

    70% Brewhouse efficiency
    1.052
    1.010
    5.48%
    24 IBU
    6.6 SRM
     

    Attached Files:

  13. NTexBrewer

    NTexBrewer Member

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    So my second iteration is very close. Color looks good and the taste is almost there. Will have to decide as I go through this batch if there is anything I want to change.
     

    Attached Files:

  14. Ozarks Mountain Brew

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    keep in mind that big breweries filter their beer with special filters we can't get to make it that clear, nothing we can really do but get the taste right
     
  15. NTexBrewer

    NTexBrewer Member

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    Yup,

    I consider the color to be a match given that theirs is filtered.
     
  16. Ozarks Mountain Brew

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    I just had a beer that came out too sweet, fermented completely and fixed it by adding a magnum dryhop in the keg then distilled water, worked great "but" my ending gravity allowed it otherwise it would be watery
     

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