Dry hop alternative method

Discussion in 'General Brewing Discussions' started by KenK, May 18, 2017.

  1. KenK

    KenK Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Madison, WI
    Instead of putting hops in the primary or secondary, either by just chucking them in or using a bag (pellets in either case), how about I just dry-hop a quart of sterile water for a few days and pour this into the bottling bucket on bottling day? Would this give the same results or only be partially or totally ineffective?
     
  2. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2016
    Messages:
    9,421
    Likes Received:
    9,472
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Pest control tech
    Location:
    Palmwoods QLD
    Good question i dont know but will be keen to find out.
     
  3. Ozarks Mountain Brew

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Messages:
    7,767
    Likes Received:
    3,976
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT Managment
    Location:
    The Ozark Mountains of Missouri
    #3 Ozarks Mountain Brew, May 18, 2017
    Last edited: May 18, 2017
    you can simmer hops in a pan for about 15 minutes then add the liquid to the fermenter stir or shake, thats been done and works
     
    Mark D Pirate and KenK like this.
  4. KenK

    KenK Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Madison, WI
    I think I'm going to try this on a batch of Sierra Nevada pale ale next week. I'll let you guys know how it turns out.
     
    Trialben likes this.
  5. das alte

    das alte Member

    Joined:
    Oct 20, 2016
    Messages:
    31
    Likes Received:
    13
    Trophy Points:
    8
    You partially hit the method. Water at pH 10 is used. The method. Hops are placed into a type of pressure cooker and high pH water is added. The lid is closed and the water temperature is increased to 214F, at 10 minutes the kettle is drained and the liquid is flash cooled. The pH is reduced and the liquid is added during bottling.
    The pH of beer is too low for dry hopping to work effectively. Try out a Randall and serve the beer through it. Problem is, it has to be recharged with hops to keep the aroma strong.
    Dry hopping causes beer to stale (Charles Bamforth).
     
    MrBIP likes this.
  6. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2012
    Messages:
    2,253
    Likes Received:
    2,451
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Back in the mountains
    Just curious but didn't the English dry hop to keep the beer on its journey to India from getting stale? I was understanding that that was how dry hopping began to be used consistently, and the result over time was the beginning of an India Pale Ale?
     
  7. chub1

    chub1 Active Member

    Joined:
    Aug 17, 2015
    Messages:
    398
    Likes Received:
    137
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    retired
    I have done hop tea a couple of times. Place desired amount of hops into a coffee press(caffatiere) pour on around 500 ml of hot water around 70c,press them and leave to stand for around 20/30 minutes or until cool enough to add to FV .Liquid can be added just before bottling or at any time.
    Not convinced that it holds anything over dry hops however!!!
     
  8. KenK

    KenK Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Madison, WI
    Good idea -- thanks! I think we have an old French coffee press around here somewhere. That could be just the ticket.
     
  9. KenK

    KenK Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Madison, WI
    That's interesting. So if dry-hopping causes beer to go stale, why do you suppose it's so widely used? Hops are expensive for us homebrewers, so you'd think that if beer doesn't have the right ph or whatever for the hops to flavor it without spoiling it, nobody would use the technique. I haven't tried it yet so I don't know that much about it. And I don't know who Charles Bamforth is -- I'll have to look him up...
     
  10. Mark D Pirate

    Mark D Pirate Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2016
    Messages:
    1,887
    Likes Received:
    1,280
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Occupation:
    Master carpenter , all round good guy
    Location:
    Radelaide SA , Australia
    Dr. Bamforth is a very well respected brewing scientist , has written a half dozen books on the science behind malting and brewing .

    While i don't doubt that some breweries would use different methods than we do on a homebrew scale it's pretty much a moot point as the quantities involved are so small for us , we don't need to emulate every practice found in commercial breweries simply because the pros do it .

    Hop teas in a coffee plunger are effective , i have used them many times in the bottling bucket
     
    BoomerBrian and KenK like this.
  11. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Messages:
    3,474
    Likes Received:
    2,688
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Austin, Texas
    Most beers that are highly hopped and extensively dry-hopped are consumed fairly young (because the hop flavor/aroma fades with time) and so shouldn't necessarily be around long enough to get stale. And how is any beer that's properly packaged going to stale? My understanding is that oxidation is the only source for staling. If O2 is present, it's going to go bad eventually, hops or no hops. Does Bamforth mean that dry-hopping can increase the chances of oxidation?
     
  12. KC

    KC Active Member

    Joined:
    Feb 25, 2015
    Messages:
    323
    Likes Received:
    179
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Location:
    NY Capital
    oxidation, infection, light, and arguably autolysis
     
  13. BoomerBrian

    BoomerBrian Active Member

    Joined:
    Jun 27, 2016
    Messages:
    371
    Likes Received:
    216
    Trophy Points:
    43
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Software Developer
    Location:
    Oklahoma
    If you are worried about oxidation you could always ferment in a keg and transfer to secondary keg with the dry hops using co2.
     
    Trialben likes this.
  14. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,365
    Likes Received:
    6,594
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Aurora, CO, USA
    Oxidation will cause staling - loss of flavor or changes in flavor due to oxidation products. Light causes skunking, conversion of iso-alpha acids into mercaptans. Infection just screws everything up due to the off flavors it produces and autolysis is the bursting of yeast cells once they die. So technically, oxidation is the only cause of staling, although some reduction reactions in the beer could cause flavor changes. The other three cause off flavors but not really staling.
     
    Mark D Pirate and J A like this.
  15. J A

    J A Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2016
    Messages:
    3,474
    Likes Received:
    2,688
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Austin, Texas
    ^^^What he said...
     
  16. Trialben

    Trialben Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 30, 2016
    Messages:
    9,421
    Likes Received:
    9,472
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Pest control tech
    Location:
    Palmwoods QLD
    Hops can also add better head retention to beer we add them because beer wouldn't be the same without them like having pizza with no cheese the two just go together and bring out the best in one another.

    Sorta like beer with me lol:p
     
    Mase likes this.
  17. krackin

    krackin Member

    Joined:
    Mar 6, 2014
    Messages:
    43
    Likes Received:
    21
    Trophy Points:
    8
    I add dry hops at 8 to 10 days, depending on temp control, etc. It seems like the stirred up yeast gets somewhat active again so I'm supposing it is using up the newly intro'd oxy. I have no science to back this, just anecdotal observation.
     
  18. emsroth

    emsroth Member

    Joined:
    Dec 4, 2016
    Messages:
    70
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    8
    Beer can go stale from dry hops if whole hops are used without being previously flushed. Perhaps directly from a nitrogen sealed package you're okay, but whole flower hops from bulk packages or fresh off the bine can introduce oxygen.

    With whole hops, I will full a keg w/ sanitizer and force out w/ CO2. Then I will off-gas, open the lid, and quickly throw in a bag of whole flower hops. I will then re-fill and purge w/ CO2. The hops will sit in here for a day or so, and the beer will be racked into the keg with a closed system. This has worked for me so far.

    Dry hopping in carboys requires the perfect amount of beer. I definitely had a beer go stale during dry hopping because of too much headspace.
     
  19. KenK

    KenK Member

    Joined:
    Mar 3, 2017
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    43
    Trophy Points:
    18
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    Retired
    Location:
    Madison, WI
    I ended up dry hopping with a hop bag in the secondary (1 oz cascade). I'm now kicking myself because this half-batch of SN pale ale is the best! Nothing but full 5 gallon brews from now on.
     
    jeffpn, BoomerBrian and Trialben like this.

Share This Page

arrow_white