brewing with pineapple

Discussion in 'Recipes for Feedback' started by oliver, Oct 24, 2015.

  1. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    i've been looking around at recipes for all grain pineapple wheat, and there are a lot of different things about when to add the pineapple.

    2.25 Gallon (ending kettle) ... 3 Gallon boil

    2.00 lb - American - Pale 2-Row
    1.75 lb - American - White Wheat
    0.50 lb - Flaked Wheat

    0.10oz Eroica at 60min
    0.25oz Eroica at 10min
    1.00 lb - Pineapple Juice (Boil 10 min)

    Wyeast 3463

    1.00 lb - Fresh Pineapple (secondary, 12-14 days)


    So i'm curious if what I have above is OK for adding pineapple? Searching online have said things like add a pound of pineapple juice to the end of the boil, then pitch yeast, and when racking to secondary add a pound of fresh pineapple. But others have said that the pineapple's acidity can kill or make it hard for the yeast to work due to its acidity, so some people suggest only adding it to the secondary aging. Any tips on this??
     
  2. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,400
    Likes Received:
    6,643
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Aurora, CO, USA
    There's an enzyme in pineapple, can't remember the name right off but it has something to do with pineapples being bromiliads, that you'll need to denature. The enzyme reduces proteins, that is, eliminates the possibility of any head retention in your beer. It's effective enough it's used in meat tenderizer. There are instructions out there to denature it.
     
  3. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    yeah i've read some stuff on that, so i think i might just wait for the secondary, and stick with pasteurized juice instead of fresh fruit. Will i still need to denature that? And will that affect my head retention if i only use it in secondary?
     
  4. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,400
    Likes Received:
    6,643
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Aurora, CO, USA
    Problem is the same: Unless you denature the bromelain, you will have problems. But you may be onto the solution: Here's a quote from BYO Magazine's "Mr Wizard":

    "I would not shy away from using pineapple, however. If you choose to use canned pineapple you should be free of bromelain because the heat treatment used for canning is far more extreme than that required for enzyme denaturation. Pasteurized pineapple juice could work, or if you want to use fresh fruit you could heat treat your own fresh fruit or juice." (Link: http://byo.com/mead/item/2124-enzyme-is ... -mr-wizard)

    If you want to use fresh pineapple, make sure you heat it to 68 degrees C (about 155 degrees F) and hold for 20 minutes. 75 degrees C works in five but you risk cooking the pineapple and setting any pectin in it.
     
  5. Ozarks Mountain Brew

    Staff Member

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Messages:
    7,767
    Likes Received:
    3,976
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Gender:
    Male
    Occupation:
    IT Managment
    Location:
    The Ozark Mountains of Missouri
    honestly Ive used fruit and fruit juice many times and all I get from flavor is the acid it has in it, all the sugar flavor is gone from the yeast eating it, now if you use freshly squeezed or even packaged lemon or lime in a keg than yes you get flavor but it doesn't take much to over power the beer
     
  6. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,400
    Likes Received:
    6,643
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Aurora, CO, USA
    I've had good luck with raspberry. Most everything else, I'd tend to agree: Thins out the body and adds acidity. And fermented fruit doesn't taste like fresh fruit (think the difference between wine and grapes).
     
  7. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2012
    Messages:
    2,254
    Likes Received:
    2,455
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Back in the mountains
    I have found a generous amount of Honey Malt(1# in 5 gal. batch) will leave enough malt sweetness to help the fruit stand out a little more. I think The Brew Mentor said he used Aromatic Malt for the same effect. The more tart the fruit, the more this helps.
     
  8. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    this is all great info. so, if i use canned pineapple as Nosybear cited, I could add this to the secondary, but what's the point of even aging that? ¿Why not just crash the beer after two weeks of primary, then go straight to bottling while adding pineapple + priming sugar,,, more along the lines of Ozark said.
     
  9. jeffpn

    jeffpn Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 28, 2015
    Messages:
    3,240
    Likes Received:
    1,557
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Canned pineapple would ferment. You would want that to be complete before bottling, otherwise you may have over carbonated bottles.
     
  10. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,400
    Likes Received:
    6,643
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Aurora, CO, USA
    You'll keep more of the fruit flavor by adding the pineapple either late in primary or in secondary. Either way, the yeast will have a field day with the simple sugars in the fruit. I do like the idea of adding honey malt or light crystal to keep some perception of sweetness to balance the fruit acidity - thanks for the idea! Next version of Raspberry Red will have some in it and a Pineapple Saison sounds like a great brew (although if I can simulate pineapple with hops, that'll likely be the way I go).
     
  11. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    i'm juggling two recipes, Pineapple Wheat and Pineapple Farmhouse, and with both i think the hops will make or break it. Probably leaning toward doing a single hop with Eroica or German Hallertau Blanc.
     
  12. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    ok, finalizing a recipe on this for a 2ish gallon batch

    2.00 lb American - Pale 2-Row
    2.00 lb American - White Wheat
    0.50 lb Canadian - Honey Malt
    0.25 lb American - Aromatic Malt
    0.25 lb American - Carapils (Dextrine Malt)

    0.10 oz Eroica at 60
    0.25 oz Eroica at 15

    Wyeast forbidden fruit 3463

    canned pineapple in the secondary at two weeks.
     
  13. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2012
    Messages:
    2,254
    Likes Received:
    2,455
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Back in the mountains
    I haven't used Aromatic Malt but once or twice in large grain bill's but with Honey Malt 4% makes a beer almost too sweet (without fruit tartness) IMHO. You have 10% so I think that could be overpowering sweetness in a lighter beer such as this. I don't know what they do to that stuff but a little goes a long way.
     
  14. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    ok i've been changing this around, but i've landed on a Pineapple White IPA, any feedback before brewday this saturday would be great.

    Batch Size: 2 gallons
    Boil Size: 3 gallons

    2.5 lb - American - Pale 2-Row (52.6%)
    1.5 lb - American - White Wheat (31.6%)
    0.5 lb - Flaked Wheat (10.5%)
    0.25 lb - Canadian - Honey Malt (5.3%)

    0.33 oz - German hull melon, 60 min
    0.33 oz - German hull melon, 30 min
    0.33 oz - German hull melon, 15 min

    Wyeast - Forbidden Fruit 3463

    1 can of pineapple in secondary for 7-10 days..
     
  15. Head First

    Head First Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 22, 2012
    Messages:
    2,254
    Likes Received:
    2,455
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Back in the mountains
    Looks good, whether you call it a fruit beer or ipa it should blend well together with what you have there.
     
  16. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    results are in (well kinda..), you win. Bottled half of this recipe (split secondary into 2 carboys, one is aging longer). initial taste thoughts from the hydrometer tube, meh. Tart, definitely tasted like fermented pineapple. But I really couldn't tell what was shining through more, the pineapple or the yeast. I used Wyeast Belgian Witbier. they might be mingling into something more. Can't make a concrete decision, this'll be ready by New Years, so i'll need to post another update.

    But, as far as aging with pineapple, hm.. I used canned pineapple chunks in juice, a 20oz can. The batch was 2 gallons, split evenly into two 1gal carboys.

    I have a couple theories for the next time, feel free to shoot me down. A) Cold crash the canned pineapple first, and just use the sugary juice in the secondary instead of the pineapple chunks with all the pulp. or B) use pineapple juice to bottle with? I really don't know how much sugar is in that juice, but that and a combination of priming sugar maybe might give off some desired flavors??


    2.5 lb American - Pale 2-Row
    1.5 lb American - White Wheat
    0.5 lb Flaked Wheat
    0.25 lb Canadian - Honey Malt
    1 oz Hull Melon, split evenly at 60, 30, and 15.
    Wyeast 3944
     
  17. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,400
    Likes Received:
    6,643
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Aurora, CO, USA
    It's pretty easy to tell how much sugar is in the juice: Take a gravity reading. Say a quart of juice comes in at 1.10. That will add 2.5 points per quart per gallon (10/4). Learning to use gravity points in calculations is one of the best bits of brewing math you can learn and it's pretty simple: GP = (Gravity-1)*1000. A 1.045 wort contains 45 gravity points.
    I just had the disappointment of putting 10 pounds of good Palisade peaches in a batch only to discover, as I stated with pineapple, fermented peaches don't taste like fresh ones. In fact, they don't taste like much at all. The Hull Melon you used would overpower the peach and I'd guess it will likely be so with the pineapple. My suggestion would be to "suggest" pineapple flavor using a hop or combination of hops and save the pineapple itself for upside-down cake. But if you want to use it, used crushed pineapple instead of chunk - more surface area for the yeast to work on and maybe a better result. Or crush the chunks. Or even better, freeze them and let the ice crystals mush it up for you.
     
  18. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    hm. I'm not putting the pineapple in the primary fermenter, just in the secondary, and when i secondary these days, it's cold crashed first, and contains almost no yeast. The pineapple gives off some bubbling ferm at around 60º , really noticeably slows down at anything lower than that. I should definitely try that though, testing gravity on the pineapple juice. it's going to be tough to suggest pineapple flavor through hops. the Hop Wheel says that Hallertau Blanc has notes of pineapple, not available at my Homebrew shop, though. As far as hops, i feel like i'm ruining any hop flavor by adding this tart asss fruit to the secondary.

    Any thoughts on bottling with the pineapple? If i had to totally come clean, drunk and all, too much kwak, good, the pineapple kick is for the girl i brew with. She shares this account, but i doubt she;ll be reading this :lol: . OK, she admitted she doesn't even super desire the taste of pineapple, just she enjoys the look and appeal of the fruit. alright, whatever. If it were me, i'd be off this game sooner than later.
     
  19. Nosybear

    Nosybear Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jul 16, 2012
    Messages:
    9,400
    Likes Received:
    6,643
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Location:
    Aurora, CO, USA
    I rarely suggest this: Take the shortcut. Pineapple extract, my friend, seems to be the answer to your dilemma.
     
  20. oliver

    oliver Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Messages:
    959
    Likes Received:
    371
    Trophy Points:
    63
    Occupation:
    LHBS owner
    Location:
    NOLA
    hey hey! Beer was pretty damn good. However, an entire ounce of Hull Melon was not noticed in a 2 gallon batch. Body was fine, not thinned, head retention was great. There wasn't a whole lot of exact pineapple flavor, the specific sweetness of pineapple did not come through, but a subtle tartness of pineapple did come through. The only problem we're encountering, is that the ounce of Hull Melon is unnoticeable. Unless it blended so well with the pineapple and Wyeast 3944 (Belgian Witbier), but i doubt that. Overall, good beer.. The sweetness could shine through a bit...The hops could really come out more.

    SO, i've since started modifying the recipe. I added an extra .25# honey malt to get the overall bill up to 5 pounds, and hope to improve the sweetness. I'm contemplating adding a bittering hop, like Centennial maybe? and then using the extra hull melon for dry hopping. And perhaps a change of yeast. My original plan was to use Wyeast Forbidden Fruit, but my home-brew shop was stocked out, so we went with 3944 instead. Maybe i try Forbidden Fruit next time, and even US-05 crossed my mind so the fruit and hops can really dominate.

    Thoughts? What are your favorite bittering hops that compliment fruit? What are your favorite yeast strains that compliment fruit?
     

    Attached Files:

Share This Page

arrow_white