Blueberry Saison

Sandy Feet

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Zambezi had me thinking about Belgian beer on another thread, and I think I want to try another Saison, but with a twist. Has anyone made a Blueberry Saison and put the fruit in the mash, boil, or primary at flame out? I was thinking about substituting the fruit for the candi sugar, and I don't want to start a second fermentation.
This is somewhere off in the future, but I always like to think of the next beer ideas while I am waiting for the current one to finish. The current one is going to take a long time.
I think I like the idea of a French Saison similar to what I did before with Pilsner & Wheat. EKG & Saaz, but with fruit. There is also a brewery in town that does a Blueberry IPA that I like.
 
I have no idea @Sandy Feet
I've never brewed with fruit, unless you count lemon peel ;)
Love a good saison. Nicest I brewed so far was with Saaz and Spalt.
EKG with 100 % pilsner was also good
 
My preferred way to add fruit is with a secondary. I've added fruit to the primary, racking on top directly from the kettle, but predicting the OG is a little tricky and I personally think you lose some of the flavor in the end.

When I do fruit now, I puree in a food processor, pasteurize using a sous vide device, then freeze until needed. Thaw and add to the bottom of a carboy, rack from the primary on top. Give it a week or so, then keg/bottle.

A blueberry saison does sound fun!
 
My initial instinct was to add it at flameout. I figured the sugars were going to be guesswork, but I might be able to get somewhat close with software and a little research. At flameout, it gets sanitized, and hopefully, doesn't lose too much flavor.
If I get really lucky, it might be able to time it to get local blueberries. It all depends on how much of the lager is gone by then though. Our blueberry season starts in April.
 
Maybe run it past the brewery that makes the Blueberry IPA and see if they can give you any tips. I've never brewed with blueberries, but I understand that the flavor is a bit difficult to get into the finished beer. Maybe a blueberry extract might be a better idea, or at least cheap insurance?

Good luck!
 
Not a bad idea the next time I get up to Sanford. I think a little would be fine if it comes out. I just started thinking about the whole farmhouse idea, using what you have, etc., plus I have been digging the Saisons again recently. I went to one place that had 4 on tap. That was nice.
 
I wonder what carries the blueberry flavor, is it an oil or a water-soluble?

If oil, heat will drive it out. Secondary would be better.

If water, time drives it out I guess, but adding it anytime would be fine. Unless you did not want to ferment the sugar.

Just thinking out loud.
 
I've been reading some things. Apparently, the fresh one create pectin when hot. The frozen blueberries break down the cell walls. The bigger flavor is supposed to be in secondary. Everything I have seen says 1-2 lbs per gallon. I thought the sugars would be easy to find online. Maybe 9.5 Brix/1.038 Specific Gravity/15SRM. Does that sound in the ballpark? I started with blackberries and changed the color.
 
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Upon further research, it just seems people hate adding blueberries to the wort during the boil/flameout because it causes haze. If I'm not making a lager, I could give a damn about a cloudy beer. I often make it cloudy on purpose and have used a little wheat in most of my recipes.
 
I would go in this direction, I've added fruit at just about every point in the brewing process. This seems to produce the best results. The amount of blueberries might need to be adjusted depending on your overall goals of the beer.

Ingredients:

  • 9 lbs Pilsner malt
  • 1 lb wheat malt
  • 0.5 lb Vienna malt
  • 0.5 lb oats
  • 0.5 lb flaked wheat
  • 1.5 oz Saaz hops (for bittering)
  • 0.5 oz Hallertau Blanc hops (for aroma)
  • 2 lb fresh blueberries (added during fermentation)
  • 1 pkg of Saison yeast
  • 1 tsp yeast nutrient
Instructions:

  1. Mash the grains: Add all of the malts to your mash tun and mix well. Heat the water to 150-160F, and add it to the grains. Keep the temperature of the mash around 150-152F for 1 hour.

  2. Lauter and sparge: Once the mash is complete, lauter and sparge your wort as usual.

  3. Boil the wort: Bring the wort to a boil and add the bittering hops. Boil for 60 minutes.

  4. Add aroma hops: Add the aroma hops for the last 5 minutes of the boil.

  5. Cool the wort: Once the boil is complete, cool the wort as quickly as possible to around 70F.

  6. Pitch the yeast: Once the wort is cooled, transfer it to your fermenter and pitch the yeast.

  7. Ferment: Ferment at around 72F for 1 week.

  8. Add blueberries: After a week of fermentation, add 2 lbs of fresh blueberries to the fermenter. Allow them to ferment for another 3-5 days.

  9. Rack to secondary: After the blueberries have been fermented, rack the beer to a secondary fermenter.

  10. Age and carbonate: Allow the beer to age for 2-3 weeks, then package and carbonate as usual.
 
That is a little different from what I planned, but I will keep it in mind. I may still tweak my recipe to incorporate one or two of those ideas. I do appreciate the response as it does give me some other things to think about.
 
I would go in this direction, I've added fruit at just about every point in the brewing process. This seems to produce the best results. The amount of blueberries might need to be adjusted depending on your overall goals of the beer.

Ingredients:

  • 9 lbs Pilsner malt
  • 1 lb wheat malt
  • 0.5 lb Vienna malt
  • 0.5 lb oats
  • 0.5 lb flaked wheat
  • 1.5 oz Saaz hops (for bittering)
  • 0.5 oz Hallertau Blanc hops (for aroma)
  • 2 lb fresh blueberries (added during fermentation)
  • 1 pkg of Saison yeast
  • 1 tsp yeast nutrient
Instructions:

  1. Mash the grains: Add all of the malts to your mash tun and mix well. Heat the water to 150-160F, and add it to the grains. Keep the temperature of the mash around 150-152F for 1 hour.

  2. Lauter and sparge: Once the mash is complete, lauter and sparge your wort as usual.

  3. Boil the wort: Bring the wort to a boil and add the bittering hops. Boil for 60 minutes.

  4. Add aroma hops: Add the aroma hops for the last 5 minutes of the boil.

  5. Cool the wort: Once the boil is complete, cool the wort as quickly as possible to around 70F.

  6. Pitch the yeast: Once the wort is cooled, transfer it to your fermenter and pitch the yeast.

  7. Ferment: Ferment at around 72F for 1 week.

  8. Add blueberries: After a week of fermentation, add 2 lbs of fresh blueberries to the fermenter. Allow them to ferment for another 3-5 days.

  9. Rack to secondary: After the blueberries have been fermented, rack the beer to a secondary fermenter.

  10. Age and carbonate: Allow the beer to age for 2-3 weeks, then package and carbonate as usual.
I assume you should mush the blueberries a bit?
 
Yup I'd treat them like a dry hop addition after primary is over.
This gives you a little insurance against introducing infections which can be a big risk when adding fruit.
That's where Metabisulphate can help to kill off any wild yeasts or bacteria on the skins of the blueberry without ruining their fragile flavours. Just a pinch would do in some blitzed up blueberry then into the fermenter you'll probably find some refermentation from the fructose in the blueberry.

Keep us posted
 
At this point, I am still playing with ideas. But, the more I think about it, I don't want to overkill the Saison with blueberry, but some would be nice. I am leaning more and more to putting a bag of frozen blueberries in the blender, making a puree, and adding it a flameout or in the very early whirlpool stage where it would be sanitized. Thus fermenting the sugars instead of candi syrup in the wort. I used 2 lbs of wheat in my last recipe that seemed to be a good substitution for the adjuncts. I do like the idea of a small amount of Vienna, but I still haven't made up my mind
 
The white stuff on the outside of fresh blueberries is wild yeast. Just like on grapes. You'll definitely want to have your yeast active when you introduced them. Frozen blueberries probably won't have this concern. It won't be as sweet but I suspect that the flavor, and some of the color, will shine through.
 
I would go in this direction, I've added fruit at just about every point in the brewing process. This seems to produce the best results. The amount of blueberries might need to be adjusted depending on your overall goals of the beer.

Ingredients:

  • 9 lbs Pilsner malt
  • 1 lb wheat malt
  • 0.5 lb Vienna malt
  • 0.5 lb oats
  • 0.5 lb flaked wheat
  • 1.5 oz Saaz hops (for bittering)
  • 0.5 oz Hallertau Blanc hops (for aroma)
  • 2 lb fresh blueberries (added during fermentation)
  • 1 pkg of Saison yeast
  • 1 tsp yeast nutrient
Instructions:

  1. Mash the grains: Add all of the malts to your mash tun and mix well. Heat the water to 150-160F, and add it to the grains. Keep the temperature of the mash around 150-152F for 1 hour.

  2. Lauter and sparge: Once the mash is complete, lauter and sparge your wort as usual.

  3. Boil the wort: Bring the wort to a boil and add the bittering hops. Boil for 60 minutes.

  4. Add aroma hops: Add the aroma hops for the last 5 minutes of the boil.

  5. Cool the wort: Once the boil is complete, cool the wort as quickly as possible to around 70F.

  6. Pitch the yeast: Once the wort is cooled, transfer it to your fermenter and pitch the yeast.

  7. Ferment: Ferment at around 72F for 1 week.

  8. Add blueberries: After a week of fermentation, add 2 lbs of fresh blueberries to the fermenter. Allow them to ferment for another 3-5 days.

  9. Rack to secondary: After the blueberries have been fermented, rack the beer to a secondary fermenter.

  10. Age and carbonate: Allow the beer to age for 2-3 weeks, then package and carbonate as usual. epoxy floor coatings tampa
I'm brewing a saison this weekend. I'm using the same grist I used last year for a raspberry saison:

11 Pils
1 Vienna
1 Wheat
WY3711

Plan is to rack onto blueberries after primary (just like I did with the raspberries). The raspberry was one of the best beers I've done. I was planning on having this one for the bottle share/tasting at my wedding in April. I wanted to do blueberries because, well, I love blueberries, I've never done a beer with them, and I could aptly name it "Something Blue." But I've recently read that the blueberry flavors fades significantly. Have any of you ever experienced this? Any other avenues I could travel to retain some blueberry flavor? I typically steer clear of concentrates because I feel like they all have a chemical/medicinal/manufactured flavor to them.
 
I haven't done mine yet, and I won't be able to until I have two days off from work. I have used 3711, and that is why I don't want to do anything past flameout with the fruit. That shit eats everything and I'm o.k. with suttle. If you do anything in secondary with that yeast, you will have a second fermentation. My last Saison had an FG of 1.002. I have family members that make Komboucha with the 3lb bag of frozen blueberries, and it is very good. That was my primary reason for thinking it would go well in a Saison.
 
I was searching the inventory of my brew store, and apparently, I can't get French Saison yeast. Do any of y'all have any experience with WLP 568 (Belgian Blend)? Temps? Attenuation? Yes, I know I can read the description, but the French Saison yeast was very sneaky in that it ate everything and attenuated much more than expected. I am curious to hear about anything unexpected with this yeast.
 
I was searching the inventory of my brew store, and apparently, I can't get French Saison yeast. Do any of y'all have any experience with WLP 568 (Belgian Blend)? Temps? Attenuation? Yes, I know I can read the description, but the French Saison yeast was very sneaky in that it ate everything and attenuated much more than expected. I am curious to hear about anything unexpected with this yeast.
I've done atleast 10 generations on WLP 565 Belgian saison 1 if it's anything like that I'll leave some malt behind for flavour not attenuating as far. If anything it gets a bad name for stalling out then kicking back off causing mayhem on the packaging side and finishing side of the brew.

So a Belgian blend might have a bit of saison 1 s characters.
If I were to brew a saison tomorrow I wouldn't hesitate to brew with this yeast.

Keep this in mind if packaging in bottles you might end up with a bit extra fizz
 

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